Dominate Person (Su) - Dispellable or not? (seems to be some confusion)

[dcollins]

No. By the rules, Supernatural abilities cannot be removed with dispel magic. This is true in both the published 3.0 and 3.5 versions of the DMG (excepting that late 3.0 errata).

The recent response by the Sage actually re-emphasized this. Although he spilled a lot of ink getting it out, in short he said "no, dispel magic won't work, but there might be some other spell that gets rid of it (depending on the exact Su ability)".

My feeling is that this sort of makes sense, if you look at the original examples intended for Supernatural abilities (in DMG). If monster-creators feel free to be putting any ability whatsoever down as Su, then the system breaks down.

Ferox4: It would be great if you could edit that post of yours above (the one posted at 23 past the hour) -- it still says on top that the quote is from 3.5 DMG Errata, which is incorrect.

 

[Ferox4]

:23 edit done.

Specifically speaking of the Vampire's Dominate (Su) - the only ways I can think of to get rid of the effects are (using core rules):

1. Make the saving throw.
2. Kill the Vampire(s) that dominated the PC(s).
3. Go to another plane until the duration of the spell wears off.
4. Cast Break Enchantment.

It can be supressed by Protection from Evil, Magic Circle vs, Evil, but that only buys time. Dispel Evil won't work because it can't dispel things that Dispel Magic also cannot dispel. I don't think Greater Spell Immunity can prevent Domination since Supernatural abilities are immune to Spell Resistance (Spell Immunity, Spell Resistance & Greater SI all being in a spell chain essentially).

What else am I missing? Wish or Miracle i suppose, but that's pretty extreme.

 

[dcollins]

Well, the Sage did specifically say that dispel evil got rid of the vampire's dominate effect. Now, perhaps he's outright mistaken. But, he would be correct if a narrow reading is taken:

Dispel Evil: ... 3. With a touch, you can automatically dispel any enchantment cast by an evil creature or any one evil spell. Exception: Spells that can't be dispelled by dispel magic also can't be dispelled by dispel evil. (3.0 PHB p. 196)

The vampire's domination ability doesn't fall into the "exception" because it's not a spell (it's a supernatural effect). Dispel magic would dispel the dominate person spell... so dispel evil is apparently allowed to dispel the supernatural enchantment which otherwise resembles dominate person.

Admittedly I wouldn't want to argue that one in court.

 

[Geoff Watson]

I thought that the (Su) note for the Vampire's Dominate ability was a typo. It should be (Sp); it's a spell-like ability because it's identical to a spell.

Geoff.

 

[ciaran00]

Can you please site where it says they can be dispelled?

Uh, I thought I had this covered, but I think that my headache from that previous thread is coming back.

ciaran

 

[Ferox4]

Uh, I thought I had this covered, but I think that my headache from that previous thread is coming back.

ciaran

C'mon - is that necessary? ....... I tried to search for other threads earlier today and if I missed the thread you're referring to I apologize. How about a link?

 

[Ferox4]

Well, the Sage did specifically say that dispel evil got rid of the vampire's dominate effect. Now, perhaps he's outright mistaken. But, he would be correct if a narrow reading is taken.......

.......The vampire's domination ability doesn't fall into the "exception" because it's not a spell (it's a supernatural effect). Dispel magic would dispel the dominate person spell... so dispel evil is apparently allowed to dispel the supernatural enchantment which otherwise resembles dominate person.

Admittedly I wouldn't want to argue that one in court.

I can buy that argument.

I thought that the (Su) note for the Vampire's Dominate ability was a typo. It should be (Sp); it's a spell-like ability because it's identical to a spell.

I don't think so. Is this an assumption you've made or did you read it in some errata or in another thread?

 

[Nightfall]

I just figured since it was Su, it could be dispelled since its affected by an antimagic effect.

 

[Darklone]

I just figured since it was Su, it could be dispelled since its affected by an antimagic effect.

Nightfall, the SRD quote above shows clearly that it's supressed in an AMF but cannot be dispelled

 

[Ferox4]

Unless I'm missing something, I'm sure it can be dispelled.

You're still playing 3.0, aren't you? I believe I remember reading that in a thread not too long ago. That would explain your stance on this issue (it was subsequently changed for 3.0).