Dragon Cohort Feat

[Greenfield]

I was browsing some news sites (quiet day at the office) and saw a story that actually touches on this.

Question: How many police and military dog handlers end up taking their trained K9 companions with them into civilian life?

Answer: Enough to make our Wyvern rider's backstory almot plausible.

Almost.

 

[N'raac]

a) Technically, he stole it. R2-D2 even objects, but Luke keeps the controls on manual to prevent R2-D2 from returning the ship to the rebellion.
b) Luke gets away with it because he's Luke. You aren't about to cashier or court martial the veritable living symbol of the Rebellion, the guy that destroyed the first death star, and who - by being a Jedi Knight - ties your rebellion back to the Old Republic and lends it legitimacy over a single snub fighter.
c) In addition to the reasonable in world justification, Luke gets away with it because he's a PC and enjoys plot protection. PC's can get in trouble over things, but no GM that stays a GM for long forces a character to retire over as minor of an issue as going AWOL in the aftermath of a chaotic battle when any sort of reasonable in world excuse (see b) exists to avoid it. The golden boy may get chewed out by his CO just to remind the player he's in a coherent world, but ultimately you aren't going to stop the story over something like this.

Exactly - we can come up with a plausible in-world reason, so we go for it.

I was browsing some news sites (quiet day at the office) and saw a story that actually touches on this.

Question: How many police and military dog handlers end up taking their trained K9 companions with them into civilian life?

Answer: Enough to make our Wyvern rider's backstory almot plausible.

Almost.

Seems more than enough for cinematic plausibility. If game balance demands no wyvern (or no X-Wing for Luke), then we have a different issue to deal with, but in-world plausibility isn't really a problem unless we really want to make it one.

No issue for Luke - although he's stepping on another player's toes (Luke's a Jedi in training - all Han really has is his own ship, so maybe Luke's player should back off and let someone else have the spotlight on occasion).

 

[Greenfield]

My own character owns/is-partnered-with a Pegasus. Her name is Oich Alaine (Lovely evening in Gaelic, or so I'm told).

When it looks like it will be plot-inconvenient for the party to have a flying scout, or for my character to have that kind of aerial mobility, I ask the DM if she (the Pegasus) should get left behind or sent away.

It's a basic courtesy, the kind of thing that DMs recognize and appreciate. It's also the reason why DMs let characters like mine own/ride Pegasus.

The player in question was running this Wyvern rider for a session, sort of a test drive, and we reached one of those moments. It was decided that Oich Alaine needed to carry a message back to an army camp, warning them of an enemy force on the march. The other player decided that two such messengers were better than one (in case one doesn't get through), and sent his Wyvern off with a duplicate message.

So he gets it. He understands that, to be trusted with an unusual resource in a game, you have to know when to ease off.

He understands that we're not in a competition, not trying to "beat" the DM. That is an important difference between this player and the departed Problem Child.

 

[Ranes]

[MENTION=6681948]N'raac[/MENTION], as Celebrim points out, technically Luke stole the X-wing but that idea does make room for a scenario in which a PC is allowed to have stolen a valuable resource once entrusted to him. Now the PC's former associates might want to get that resource back. Voila: a potentially recurring campaign element.

I'm not so keen on justification by K9 analogy. Trained police dogs are a valuable resource but I'm not sure they're as valuable as an airborne cavalry asset. I take the point, though, of course. And it was me who compared the value of the wyvern to that of a contemporary, frontline, fast jet fighter, which some might suggest was a slightly loaded argument to begin with. (Although, I did say it was a 'big ask', not that it was entirely unjustifiable.)

Meanwhile, all seems well...

So he gets it. He understands that, to be trusted with an unusual resource in a game, you have to know when to ease off.

He understands that we're not in a competition, not trying to "beat" the DM. That is an important difference between this player and the departed Problem Child.

Excellent. Result.

 

[N'raac]

a) Technically, he stole it. R2-D2 even objects, but Luke keeps the controls on manual to prevent R2-D2 from returning the ship to the rebellion.
b) Luke gets away with it because he's Luke. You aren't about to cashier or court martial the veritable living symbol of the Rebellion, the guy that destroyed the first death star, and who - by being a Jedi Knight - ties your rebellion back to the Old Republic and lends it legitimacy over a single snub fighter.
c) In addition to the reasonable in world justification, Luke gets away with it because he's a PC and enjoys plot protection. PC's can get in trouble over things, but no GM that stays a GM for long forces a character to retire over as minor of an issue as going AWOL in the aftermath of a chaotic battle when any sort of reasonable in world excuse (see b) exists to avoid it. The golden boy may get chewed out by his CO just to remind the player he's in a coherent world, but ultimately you aren't going to stop the story over something like this.

I think (c) is more relevant here than (a) or (b). I recall Artoo noting Luke's course was wrong for the rendezvous point, but not any discussion of "stealing" the X-Wing (or "going AWOL" - I think the Rebellion was largely a volunteer effort anyway). No one ever commented on it later - he just spent however much time he spent in training, looking for Han, etc. culminating in the Jabba's Palace infiltration at the start of RoTJ. And who knew he was a Jedi Knight? For that matter, who had the authority to confer that title on him? I don't think Yoda made weekly dispatches to Rebellion HQ. I suspect a lot of Rebellion members shared Han and Tarkin's vision of the Jedi and the Sith.

Something must have happened in the interim, as their return to Rebellion HQ didn't attract any stares on-screen, and Lando seemed to have a pretty high position in the Rebellion (just by virtue of being Obi-Wan's player's new character?). Somehow, Han moved from "mercenary who's here for a bit, but skipping back to his old life" at the start of ESB" to "General Solo" while encased in carbonite (well, he must have made name level, so he's a General, however thin the in world justification). How come all the guys caught up (maybe also passed) Leia in the rebel hierarchy?

In any case, I don't see why the Wyvern Rider is any less entitled to PC Halo than Luke, Han and Lando are. He's one of the "Luke/Han/Lando's" of this game world.

I agree with Greenfield's concerns about balance, but if those can be addressed, the player is spending a resource (a feat) to be allowed an advantage (the wyvern). Make it happen.

Another tangent: Sounds like acceptance that the Pegasus and Wyvern being sent away when it would be plot-inconvenient for the PC's to have access to flight. Would we be so accepting if Fly spells stopped working, as did the wings of a PC of an unusual race? The classic "well, I want a long travel scenario, so teleportation mysteriously can't get you there" is a similar situation. I'm also recalling "special sleep spells" that worked on elves.

I think the player spending character resources (I'm not clear the Pegasus rider did, but the wyvern rider spent a feat) is entitled to use those resources. But every game has to come to a balance between "player resources and agency" and "make the game work". If I were the wyvern rider, and I was expected to send the wyvern away whenever it would really shine, I'd be pretty unhappy, but once in a while would not bother me.

 

[Herobizkit]

"Departed" Problem Child? Are you finally free?

Well, back in 2e there was a Dragon Rider kit (or some such) that guaranteed a character had a Dragon mount.

So I gave him a Mist Dragon.

From the Monstrous Manual:

"Mist dragons are solitary and philosophical. Their favorite activity is sitting quietly and thinking. They hate being disturbed and dislike conversation."

"Combat: Mist dragons try to avoid encounters by assuming mist form. In combat, they quickly use their breath weapons, then assume mist form and hide in the vapor - where they launch a spell assault."

In RP, I had this Dragon be annoyed any time he was addressed, let alone being asked to help fight. Most often, it just hung out in Mist form and generally kept to its own.

Hilariously, this worked for the player as he was a Lizardman; he had to regularly moisten his skin or start suffering Con penalties, so this a win-win in everybody's book.

Just because he wants a Dragon, doesn't mean the Dragon has to LIKE him... just obey him.

Also, he shouldn't be able to "build" any kind of a dragon - he should get a stock Wyvern with all of the rage and horse-likeness it entails.

Also also (from the same Monstrous Manual):

"An adult wyvern consumes the equivalent of a man-sized to large creature once per day. This could translate to a horse, pig, or a handful of sheep. While it eats them whole, the bones are not digested, and neither are metal objects. The wyvern eats carrion only if desperate."

Have fun with THAT.

 

[Greenfield]

Another tangent: Sounds like acceptance that the Pegasus and Wyvern being sent away when it would be plot-inconvenient for the PC's to have access to flight. Would we be so accepting if Fly spells stopped working, as did the wings of a PC of an unusual race? The classic "well, I want a long travel scenario, so teleportation mysteriously can't get you there" is a similar situation. I'm also recalling "special sleep spells" that worked on elves.

I think the player spending character resources (I'm not clear the Pegasus rider did, but the wyvern rider spent a feat) is entitled to use those resources. But every game has to come to a balance between "player resources and agency" and "make the game work". If I were the wyvern rider, and I was expected to send the wyvern away whenever it would really shine, I'd be pretty unhappy, but once in a while would not bother me.

We originally removed Teleportation and it's long-range relatives from the game specifically to keep the travel scenario an active part of the story. In this current incarnation, we allowed them, but with sharp limitations: They are both Rituals that take a while. Also, they can only be cast at places where the Ley lines meet, and can only take you to another convergence of Ley lines.

As for the Pegasus rider and his mount: The Pegasus is ridden by my character. His acquisition of the mount was approved beforehand by the group. He paid money for it. Oddly enough, Giant eagle, Giant Owl, Pegasus, Hippogriff etc. have prices listed in the MM for eggs, for young, for training, etc.

In addition, Pegasus have the ability to cast Detect Evil at will, and will only serve a Good rider in support of good causes. My character's partner/mount has occasionally refused to carry party members who weren't of Good alignment. She is under the joint control of both the player (me) and the DM, since she has a 10 INT, and is functionally an NPC at least half the time.