[Dragon] Dragon #307

[King_Stannis]

Thanks for all of the detail, Tsyr. Yeah, Stannis as a paladin is sort of...surprising. Don't get me wrong, as you may guess the guy doesn't have a bigger backer than me , but I would have thought "fighter", as you say, or something akin to the "Knight" class from Mongoose's class-pamphlets, would be more fitting. From what you say it seems like they tried to shoehorn quite a bit of Martin's round world into a square hole.

Still, I'll probably get it - if only for the map (though I was hoping for a little bit of information on some of the other places - Asshai, for one).

I only hope that Guardians of Order does a better job trying to adapt the material for 3e....though I'm sure Dragon had an almost impossible task of satisfying fans while maintaining a reasonable page count within the mag. So, props to them for giving Martin the love.

I'll buy it and give it a look.

 

[Davelozzi]

Noble adventurer -- does it gain a whole lot of bonus feats ?

This actually doesn't sound too bad to me, assuming the class doesn't get the Fighter bonus feats or a load of other abilities.

Yes, it does get the fighter bonus feats at every other level. I somehow forgot to mention that before but have edited my original post to reflect it. I agree that without the bonus feats, it wouldn't be nearly as bad.

 

[drnuncheon]

Thanks for all of the detail, Tsyr. Yeah, Stannis as a paladin is sort of...surprising.

Especially since Stannis is pretty much the poster child for Lawful Neutral, from his reasons for wanting the realm to his treatment of Ser Davos.

J

 

[JoeBlank]

Re: Re: [Dragon] Dragon #307

Hey, I've got the same question this guy had. Anyone who has read all 3 books have any info about the degree of spoilers in Dragon? Thanks.

Could someone who has finished A Storm of Swords review the Westeros section for spoilers and let the rest of us know how bad it is? I am about 2/3 of the way thru the book, so I may have to save this issue, along with the earlier excerpt from A Feast for Crows, until later.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

I haven't looked at all 5 of them, but at least a few of the PrCs in the "Heroes of Cormyr" article seem pretty unbalanced to me. Particularly the Noble Adventurer - minimal requirements, fighter BAB & bonus feats every other level, 6 skill points per level, and two good saves - that's too good to resist for a fighter.

The Royal Scout has similar problems but wasn't quite as bad.

NA is pushing the envelope of balanced, but I find that the d8 hit die balances out the extra skill points -- since the majority of skill additions beyond the fighters list are social skills (except for Spot and Search). Taking this gives you a slightly less-tough fighter who becomes particularly useful in a social setting. It would be easier to swallow with 4 skill points, though.

I do like the Royal Scout -- makes a good Ranger PrC. And Moon Drover -- catoblepas, WTF? Even knowing the setting I think that's a weird one.

As to the Westeros stuff, *shrug*. You want me to take a man seriously who actually uses the GURPS rules?

Actually, if anything the section convinced me I need to find and read the books, which I haven't yet. I thought the Ice Wall campaign idea & the Rangers of the Night's Watch were particularly intriguing.

 

[Sollir Furryfoot]

Dash Dannigan:

On pg. 30 in the 'For Your Character' section, the Wilora is given a Level Adjustment (ECL) of +2...scary, isn't it?

 

[Dash Dannigan]

Woops guess I'm the one at fault with the cursory glance here heh!

I see what you mean, 4 levels for all of the critter features. Phew, someone missed that editing error you'd think. As long as the party remains nocturnal you'd be ok, if not, you're stuck being a talking crane for most of the time, heh. Make one heck of a Sorc or Wiz though.

I've taken a closer look at those Cormyr PrCs and they look pretty good. I agree with mercule when it comes to the Noble Adventurer class. Not bad at all. I especially like the moon drover, pretty neat.

What do you guys think about the good monster cult PrCs? The Artist's Vengeance crack me up. But for the most part they have some interesting features, the tree friend being my favorite, I can't really see a druid going for it neccessarily but pretty neat for rangers. The Artist's Vengeance has some nice benefits at 5th: becoming a native outsider, darkvision, and sprouting wings to fly (besides sprouting a tail too lol).

 

[Kesh]

Shades? Mmmph... those almost convinced me to buy Shadowbane, even though I'm unemployed. That'll make this issue worthwhile.

 

[Endur]

Stannis Spoilers

There are some spoilers about Stannis and his sword in #307.

The articles are interesting. Not what I was hoping for, but interesting.

I agree that a true D20 Westeros probably would have very few Paladins. A Knight class of some sort would be necessary, either as a base class, or as a PRC similar to the cavalier (but accessable at lower level).

I think, personally, that Stannis comes pretty close to being a Paladin. In spite of everything Melisandre does, he is pretty close to LG. LG/LN is a good alignment description for him.

Eddard Stark was definitely LG.

Tom

 

[Dr. Strangemonkey]

I think there is a place for the Paladin in Westeros. Though perhaps a less 'pure' version than one sees in most settings.

The morality associated with knighthood in the books and short story seems to imply that there is something to chivalry that sets one a bit beyond the norm.

I would say that what one sees is a lot of cavaliers some few of whom have managed to cast themselves in a better and more devoted light.

And I'm very certain that the paladin equivalent that is in operation is far more flexible about falling from, getting back on, and treading narrow versions of the path than most DMs are willing to allow.