Dragonlance Dragonlance Shadow of the Dragon Queen shows up in the wild!

[pukunui]

I re-read the Chronicles a month or so ago in anticipation of the 5e book coming out ... and yeah, fine literature they are not. The prose is pretty awful in places, as is the poetry. They do not read aloud nicely either (not like a Discworld novel does).

That said, I still enjoy the story for the most part, and Laurana is still my favorite character.

 

[darjr]

Also a lot of people forget that the Novels were marketing. As good or great or influential as they are they were made as a marketing tool.

And what went into the initial spark of the reason to do the whole thing was based off customer surveys.

They became the foundation of a product line that kept TSR afloat and arguably their best selling products. However at the time they didn’t know any of that.

 

[Reynard]

Also a lot of people forget that the Novels were marketing. As good or great or influential as they are they were made as a marketing tool.

They became the foundation of a product line that kept TSR afloat and arguably their best selling products. However at the time they didn’t know any of that.

And they are "good" from a certain perspective: they are wonder YA fantasy AND they pull you into D&D. Win-win. They just haven't aged well.

 

[Steel_Wind]

And they are "good" from a certain perspective: they are wonder YA fantasy AND they pull you into D&D. Win-win. They just haven't aged well.

Well, yes...but it's more than that. It's the authors and their writing style.

Dragons of Deceit (referenced above) was released in August 2022. The problems inherent to the text and narrative style remains. It's the YA premise and target age of the novel's audience. Or at least, the ground rules which governs the YA nature of the prose and plot.

But since the original DL Chronicles, it's almost been 40 years. Since DL was in its heyday, we have had a lot of GRRM inspired post-modern fantasy go our way. And that's before we get to Game of Thrones and House of the Dragon, too. All of which brings us into grim and gritty themes and narrative styles that have changed over the years. It is an issue which still divides the tastes of many of us.

I appreciate that this remains a significant point of disagreement even among older gamers. Hell, swearing on ENWorld is still seen as in invitation to moderate and remove such language.

I get it, but the YA stuff is no longer for me - and I can't pretend otherwise.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

It's easy to forget that Dragonlance pretty much invented the YA genre - at least it came out before there where YA sections is bookshops. But I do read some modern YA stuff (I can't be doing with GRRM doom and gloom, RL is grimdark enough for me) and at least some of it is now a lot better written than Dragonlance was.

 

[Reynard]

It's easy to forget that Dragonlance pretty much invented the YA genre - at least it came out before there where YA sections is bookshops. But I do read some modern YA stuff (I can't be doing with GRRM doom and gloom, RL is grimdark enough for me) and at least some of it is now a lot better written than Dragonlance was.

The invention of the YA genre has a negative impact on a lot of earlier fiction. A Wizard of Earthsea ends up there because it's young protagonist, but it is a book every fantasy fan should read regardless of age. The Last Unicorn, too -- some of the most beautiful prose in all of fantasy fiction and it gets stuck in the YA section because cartoon I guess.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

The invention of the YA genre has a negative impact on a lot of earlier fiction. A Wizard of Earthsea ends up there because it's young protagonist, but it is a book every fantasy fan should read regardless of age. The Last Unicorn, too -- some of the most beautiful prose in all of fantasy fiction and it gets stuck in the YA section because cartoon I guess.

the issue is that YA gets a bad wrap as 'low' versions of there genre when like you said some of the best writing is done there.

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

the issue is that YA gets a bad wrap as 'low' versions of there genre when like you said some of the best writing is done there.

(Because teens have a harder time judging what makes media good, so bad authors get by easier writing YA than writing adult fiction.)

And I say this as someone that has read a lot of YA books over the past decade.

 

[Reynard]

the issue is that YA gets a bad wrap as 'low' versions of there genre when like you said some of the best writing is done there.

Those weren't done there, they were banished there. That was my point.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Those weren't done there, they were banished there. That was my point.

And your point is wrong, since it carries the prejudice that everything YA is assumed to be bad, whereas some of the new stuff is of as high standard as Le Guin. There is plenty of really bad OA (Old Adult) literature published too. That doesn't make it all bad.

 

[Weiley31]

The adventure also includes gnomish field radios.

Spoiler

View attachment 267734

I can't wait to introduce the concept of the Gnomish "ye-old Morse Code" stations used by certain Knights of Solamnia outposts alongside the "ye-old field radios" as well.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I can't wait to introduce the concept of the Gnomish "ye-old Morse Code" stations used by certain Knights of Solamnia outposts alongside the "ye-old field radios" as well.

Clacks.

 

[Demetrios1453]

I can't wait to introduce the concept of the Gnomish "ye-old Morse Code" stations used by certain Knights of Solamnia outposts alongside the "ye-old field radios" as well.

Given the reputation of Krynn gnome technology, that could lead to... interesting results. Probably nothing lethal, but soldiers at those stations turning blue, getting covered in chicken feathers, and so on...

 

[Reynard]

And your point is wrong, since it carries the prejudice that everything YA is assumed to be bad, whereas some of the new stuff is of as high standard as Le Guin. There is plenty of really bad OA (Old Adult) literature published too. That doesn't make it all bad.

No, it's not, because I am not casting aspertions on YA. But it is a different publishing category and many adults won't go looking there and it is inappropriate for books that aren't YA fiction to be relegated there.

Publishing category create divisions that wouldn't otherwise exist, and encourage writers to create books that shouldn't exist -- at least in the form they end up in. I don't know if you write and/or spend time on writers' forums, but lots and lots of writers end up agonizing over their book not fitting perfectly into a publishing category and then compromising the work in order to force it to fit.

 

[Steel_Wind]

To be clear, while I do believe that there was some attempt to publish a YA branded and trade-dressed edition of the DL Chronicles after Harry Potter set the YA section ablaze in book stores in the 2000s, overwhelmingly, gaming fiction has been stocked and sold in the Adult Fantasy /Sci Fi section of the bookstore.

It isn't that the books are aimed at YA in terms of explicit marketing. It's that the publisher has chosen to keep the books as squeaky clean as 80s Del Rey Fantasy.

Once more: this is not my cuppa. Yes. I think it is a mistake.

 

[darjr]

Review of the boardgame with nice hi res photos.

Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn Board Game Review

Dragonlance Board Game Review for Warriors of Krynn

ginnyloveday.com

 

[pukunui]

Review of the boardgame with nice hi res photos.

Dragonlance: Warriors of Krynn Board Game Review

Dragonlance Board Game Review for Warriors of Krynn

ginnyloveday.com

Thanks for sharing that. Makes me feel a bit better about not getting it.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

No, it's not, because I am not casting aspertions on YA. But it is a different publishing category and many adults won't go looking there and it is inappropriate for books that aren't YA fiction to be relegated there.

Publishing category create divisions that wouldn't otherwise exist, and encourage writers to create books that shouldn't exist -- at least in the form they end up in. I don't know if you write and/or spend time on writers' forums, but lots and lots of writers end up agonizing over their book not fitting perfectly into a publishing category and then compromising the work in order to force it to fit.

So, you would rather see A Wizard of Earthsea marketed in such a way that implies it is unsuitable for a 13 year old reader? That sees it no longer added to school and junior libraries? You think an adult who has spent the last 30 years reading drivel like Jodi Picoult* will suddenly pick up and enjoy Earthsea because it's on an adult shelf?

How old where you when you first read Earthsea? I'm certain I was in my teens. The fact is that most people who have read Earthsea will have first read it as teenagers. If they haven't read it by the time they are an adult it's because they don't like fantasy and are never going to read it. Sure, some stuff, like Dragonlance, relies on teenagers lacking discernment, but how do you think they learn discernment? It's by also reading quality stuff like Earthsea. If they aren't exposed to that as "young adults" they will grow up to be undiscerning adults and read Jodi Picoult.


*To be fair, adult fiction gets much much worse than Jodi. I just can't bear to think about it.

 

[Veltharis ap Rylix]

Not sure the best place to note this, but DDB seems to have put out a new "Monstrous Compendium" for Dragonlance. Not seeing an advertisement beyond just the on-site banner at the moment. @darjr

Get Monstrous Compendium Volume Two: Dragonlance Creatures at no cost - D&D Beyond

www.dndbeyond.com

 

[Weiley31]

I like Ember the Dragon, Forsworn, and the Verminaad stat block.

Also, looks like this edition they are playing up the Oni relations with the Idra by giving them the single horn style that Oni are depicted with at times.