Dragonrider, Mounted Archer

[Lanfear]

Where did you get that template from?

I wrote it

Half-dragon is a +3 LA template.

y, you're right. but as everyone in my grp has a +1LA for free (we have a fire genasi and a aasimar who both starts as lvl1 without taking an additional level) that will be fine.

substitution means in this case just "added", to resemble the levels needed for the Half-Dragon. It has nothing to do with the other stuff you menthioned.

Oh an important ...

thank you, i have to remember that and i have to tell it my DM that she knows it too.

 

[glass]

Make sure to check with the DM on this one - there are many places (in any game) where a mount cannot go. That was one of the reasons for 3.0 using the summoning of the mount from the celestial plane - to account for this so that the mount doesn't have to simply wait around while the paladin goes about dungeon crawling.

As long as the mount remains medium, there is nowhere the mount cannot go that a human PC also could not. EDIT: RAW, at least. Narratively, there may be some differences, which is why we have a DM!

One thing to check with the DM is whether the extra HD the mount gets will cause a size increase. I so 'no' IMC, but AFIAC, the rules don't actually specify and the last thing you want is your mount suddenly becoming large!


glass.

 

[irdeggman]

I wrote it

y, you're right. but as everyone in my grp has a +1LA for free (we have a fire genasi and a aasimar who both starts as lvl1 without taking an additional level) that will be fine.

If so then use the full level progressions instead of the "reduced" one you came up with to keep up with the "free +1 LA" that the others have.

See the attached zip file (or go to the WotC site to get the better one)

Savage Progressions Archive

thank you, i have to remember that and i have to tell it my DM that she knows it too.

Very important since the fire genasi and aasimar are both non-humanoids, so the party is really affected by this rule.

 

[irdeggman]

Some other things to keep track of:

You won't get the +1 attack from being mounted if your mount is Medium sized, unless the opponent is small.

Combat while Mounted: With a DC 5 Ride check, you can guide your mount with your knees so as to use both hands to attack or defend yourself. This is a free action.

When you attack a creature smaller than your mount that is on foot, you get the +1 bonus on melee attacks for being on higher ground. If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack. Essentially, you have to wait until the mount gets to your enemy before attacking, so you can’t make a full attack. Even at your mount’s full speed, you don’t take any penalty on melee attacks while mounted.

If your mount charges, you also take the AC penalty associated with a charge. If you make an attack at the end of the charge, you receive the bonus gained from the charge. When charging on horseback, you deal double damage with a lance (see Charge).

You can use ranged weapons while your mount is taking a double move, but at a –4 penalty on the attack roll. You can use ranged weapons while your mount is running (quadruple speed), at a –8 penalty. In either case, you make the attack roll when your mount has completed half its movement. You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving. Likewise, you can take move actions normally

So you want mounted combat and mounted archery feats in order to take advantage of your character concept. Too bad you are running a halfling (no human bonus feat) and paladin (no bonus fighter feats).

MOUNTED ARCHERY [GENERAL]
Prerequisites: Ride 1 rank, Mounted Combat.
Benefit: The penalty you take when using a ranged weapon while mounted is halved: –2 instead of –4 if your mount is taking a double move, and –4 instead of –8 if your mount is running.
Special: A fighter may select Mounted Archery as one of his fighter bonus feats.

MOUNTED COMBAT [GENERAL]
Prerequisite: Ride 1 rank.
Benefit: Once per round when your mount is hit in combat, you may attempt a Ride check (as a reaction) to negate the hit. The hit is negated if your Ride check result is greater than the opponent’s attack roll. (Essentially, the Ride check result becomes the mount’s Armor Class if it’s higher than the mount’s regular AC.)
Special: A fighter may select Mounted Combat as one of his fighter bonus feats.

You will also need exotic saddles since it is not a horse (which cost 3x the normal equivalent) - get a military saddle, you need the benefits.


I think there are some flying mount feats out there too, just don't know where they are.

Also don't think of a paladin's mount as a "pet" - the bond is much, much closer. You suffer a lot of penalties if your mount dies.

As someone else mentioned I believe a dragon's size is dependent on its HD - which may cause problems later due to the paladin mount benefits.

Also the mount's bonus skill points work kind of funky since they are based on monster skills for dragons.

Skills: All dragons have skill points equal to (6 + Int modifier, minimum 1) x (Hit Dice + 3). Most dragons purchase the following skills at the maximum ranks possible: Listen, Search, and Spot. The remaining skill points are generally spent on Concentration, Diplomacy, Escape Artist, Intimidate, Knowledge (any), Sense Motive, and Use Magic Device at a cost of 1 skill point per rank. All these skills are considered class skills for dragons. (Each dragon has other class skills as well, as noted in the variety descriptions.)

 

[Lanfear]

hi again, and thanks for the input!

i thought about the following feat progression:

Feats:
[sblock]1 - Mounted Combat
1 (Ranger) - Track
3 - Mounted Archery
4 (Ranger) - Rapid Shot
5 - Adaptable Breath
6 - Clinging Breath
9 - Dragon Breath
10 - Dragon Steed
10 (Ranger) - Endurance
12 - Devoted Tracker
15 - Point Blank Shot
15 - Precise Shot
18 - Weapon Focus (Weapon)[/sblock]as you see, we grant additional feats every 5 levels, 4 in total. We do not play much, and we hope to adchive a bit broader feat range for our characters, because with the "few" feats, you can only follow one route, the character stays specialized.

Adaptable Breath is from the 4th Edition (dragonscale), which my DM allowed me to take (i will take the "Fire" Damage )

The Mount will surely get additional HD from Ranger/Paladin, but he will not advance in his Age. I just seperate the Advancement from the Base Creature. The dragon dont get older just because he flys with a paladin

there is an article from the wizards page, i still have to read
Rules of the Game: All About Mounts (Part One)

 

[irdeggman]

IMO taking Weapons Focus and Point Blank Shot at so late of levels is a waste.

By the time a PC reaches 18th level he will have sufficient magic weapons that a measly +1 to hit is negligible.

Taking Point Blank Shot at 15th level is likewise mostly wasted. The best reason to take PBS for an archer is to get to Far Shot which increases your range by 50% and Precise Shot (eliminates penalty for shooting into melee).

Remember that if you shoot into melee you suffer a -4 penalty on attacks and if there is someone (friend or foe) between you and your target that your target also gains soft cover (+4 to AC). This is something that a lot of people also forget about, they remember the shooting into melee penalty but forget about the soft cover penalty and the fact that they are additive.

 

[Lanfear]

yeah, i know. the WF is not a important Feat, but i want the precise shot for the reason you said.

i need more talent points at lower levels its a mess. i cant take everything.
i need Mounted Combat/Mounted Archery with lvl11 as prereq. for the Halfling Outrider. Dragon Breath, Clinging Breath and Adaptable Breath are cool, and the earlier i take them, the better. every level i drop them down the list, they lose on efficiency.

Maybe i can talk to my DM and get 2 feats for the spellcasting ability of the paladin and ranger in exchange. i dont need or plan to cast spells anyway. but i dont think that he will give me the feats.

 

[irdeggman]

Complete Warrior pg 13 has spell-less paladin and spell-less ranger variants. Themed and not free bonus feats but rather different abilities that may be good.

Note that if you give up spellcasting ability then you won't be able to use wands except via the Use Magic Device skill.

A 1st level paladin can use a wand of Cure Serious Wounds even though he can't cast the spell yet. The only requisite is that it is on his spell list. If you give up spell casting then he no longer has a spell list.

This may be fine, but think it over seriously. There are a lot of advantages to being a spellcaster even if you don't have the spells to cast.

I think you need to decide on what path you want to take. Archer or dragon breath guy. IIRC most of the dragon breath abilities are close range so that limits things a lot.

You might want to think about dipping into fighter for a couple of levels for the bonus feats to help with the archery path.

IMO a paladin is more valuable than a ranger in the situation you are in.

 

[Lanfear]

yeah, you're right, losing the ability to use wands will not be great
the spell-less paladin variant as the ranger one are both not great (read: BS)

the only possibility will be, that my DM allows me to buy the +LA off like the UA offers, then i would be able to take 2 lvls of fighter.

 

[irdeggman]

yeah, you're right, losing the ability to use wands will not be great
the spell-less paladin variant as the ranger one are both not great (read: BS)

the only possibility will be, that my DM allows me to buy the +LA off like the UA offers, then i would be able to take 2 lvls of fighter.

Oh and don't forget the multiclass xp penalty since ranger, paladin nor fighter are "favored classes" for a halfling. 20% xp penalty for each that is more than 1 level from the highest one - so could be a 40% penalty.

Again I think you need to focus more on what kind of character you really want to play. A "dragon" or an archer - it is almost impossible to play both real effectively at the same time.

As someone pointed out before - going with a dragon cohort instead of the paladin mount route might be more efficient. It only costs 1 or 2 feats and that frees you up to go with a straight fighter type for the bonus feats.