Druids

[Aus_Snow]

Druids... yeah. The only party that's better than 4 clerics are four druids.

One summoner (taking out traps too), one archer, one blaster, one healer... and if the enemy closes to melee, they all can do melee.

Indeed. All that [and more], and it's kinda like a party of 8, not 4.

OK, the critters are not on an even keel there, but still.

 

[lukelightning]

I also know of at least one guy's homebrew setting that doesn't allow humans. So there.

If you are talking about homebrew settings then everything goes out the window or becomes house rules forum material.

 

[Aus_Snow]

If you are talking about homebrew settings then everything goes out the window or becomes house rules forum material.

As opposed to FR and Eberron, where all kinds of things get added in or changed by default?

Them bein' the official settings and all that.

 

[kenobi65]

Particularly in natural environments, druids can be ba-roken.

 

[werk]

I don't know, they've always been the nature priest type druid in my campaigns, very secretive so no one really knows anything about them or how they work, really. Most players IME run them like clerics that can shapechange, which seems to work OK. My problem, as printed (or as I've seen as printed played), is that they really only shine as a caster...ok at combat, ok at healing, ok at most things, but not great at anything and with a lot of limitations that don't make immediate sense.

I considered changing up to Terry Brooks' style Shanarra druids when 3.0 launched, but the current version can fall close to that without a rewrite given the available player options

Spell Compedium adds a lot of (powerful) druid spells, worth checking out if you are going to play one, especially at higher levels. Setting materials also seem to hide some druid goodness, I seem to remember the forgotten realms had some people crying that druids were broken or would be if not banned.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

The Druid is potentially above average at everything. So it makes a fine 2nd spellcaster or 2nd meatshield, if optimized for that role.

The case for the Druid being an overpowered class rests almost entirely on mythical evidence of Wild Shape + Animal Growth + Dragonskin Armor destroying campaigns. Of those rare few people who have testified to seeing the mighty Wild Shape + Animal Growth in actual play in threads on the potency of the Druid, most have denied that the Druid was overpowered in the overall context of the campaign.

I would note that Wild Shape + Animal Growth is no longer legal.

I have also noticed that few people with strong opinions on this topic are aware that the Druid class does have its weaknesses. First of all, its spell selection is the weakest of the primary spellcaster classes -- the majority of popular meat & potatoes spells appear late or never on the Druid spell list. The Cleric and the Wizard both have markedly superior offensive and defensive spell selection at low levels. Second of all, the Druid tends to have the worst AC in the party by a country mile, and Wildshaping usually makes this problem even worse.

 

[lukelightning]

As opposed to FR and Eberron, where all kinds of things get added in or changed by default?

Them bein' the official settings and all that.

Neither setting bans druids or humans or any other standard RAW feature.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

I'm curious to know how others treat the class. Do you allow it? Do you like it? If you rebuilt the Druid from the ground-up, what would you do with it? What should the druid be?

I like that the Druid class breaks away from the Cleric. Domains are a good start, but just do not go far enough for my tastes. The Druid is a reasonable approximation of what a Cleric of Animal and Nature domains should look like.

I think that Wildshaping should be a PrC. It is too much of a headache for a primary class ability of a Core class. (Which is not too say that I believe it is overpowered. But just too annoying ruleswise.)

IMO the Cleric and Druid should be reconsituted into a single class with powerful domains. Turning should be a domain ability. Spontaneous casting should be ruled by domain (or supplemented by feats). Weak Wildshaping could be part of a domain as a domain spell with better Wildshaping as part of a PrC. Weapon/armor selection should also be tied more closely to domains. Ditto class skills.

 

[GreatLemur]

If you are talking about homebrew settings then everything goes out the window or becomes house rules forum material.

If der_kluge's question was "Does your non-houseruled store-bought setting allow Druids?", it would be almost pointless, wouldn't it? I think there are a lot of games out there that ban elements of the core rules. Hell, I tend to keep demi-humans out of any game I run, for example.

 

[smetzger]

So, in thinking about the game, I come across the topic of druids.

I admit that I don't know much about the class. It seems rather enigmatic. The role the druid seems to play doesn't strike me as being necessary for a core party. It's always a "5th" party member sort of class, like a Bard.

I'm curious to know how others treat the class. Do you allow it? Do you like it? If you rebuilt the Druid from the ground-up, what would you do with it? What should the druid be?

I think its most difficult for them to take the Tank role. But if no-one wants to be a Wizard, Cleric, or Rogue then the Druid can perform adequately in these roles.

IME they are too powerful in the 8-13 lvl range.

My changes to the class...
1. Get rid of spontaneus Summon Natures Aly.
2. Druid can speak to their animal companion as if using speak with animals.
3. Spontaneuous cast speak with animals

I haven't tested these changes out completly.