Druids

[Theuderic]

At least I know where my opposite stands. .

And people claim paladins are dumb... [/QUOTE

Where does your opposite stand? Good/evil has nothing to do with it When it comes to the original D&D druids, it's law/chaos and the preservation of nature that they are concerned with. And as far as paladins are concerned, I've NEVER heard anyone claim that paladins are dumb, if so then that would be a "dumb" statement on their part to say the least.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

At least I know where my opposite stands. .

And people claim paladins are dumb... [/QUOTE

Where does your opposite stand? Good/evil has nothing to do with it When it comes to the original D&D druids, it's law/chaos and the preservation of nature that they are concerned with. And as far as paladins are concerned, I've NEVER heard anyone claim that paladins are dumb, if so then that would be a "dumb" statement on their part to say the least.

You've never heard the term "Lawful Stupid" to describe a paladin? I can't imagine.

At any rate, I think you missed my point. Doesn't matter if I'm Lawful and my enemy's Chaotic, or I'm Evil and my enemy is Good, or whatever. If a group of people show a tendency to follow an agenda I can't comprehend which involves them switching allies, I'm going to stop trusting them. They keep doing it over a long enough period of time, and someone's going to decide that they are too unpredictable to be anything but an enemy. And since the enemy you know is infinitely preferable to the one you can't figure out, it becomes time to exterminate the druids. They would be on everyone's Judas list. Getting themselves slaughtered by making EVERYONE (good, evil, law, chaos, and the society of people named "Phil") their enemy is just plain stupid. Regardless of whatever bizarre reasons we concoct.

Besides, a strong argument can be made that the M.O. of druids is that of a Good person who takes the long view- They keep ALL creatures, including sentients, at something resembling the carrying capacity of the land. They just butt heads with humans a lot since humans are the only non-insects who will deliberately raise their adult population above the land's carrying capacity. But all that means is that druids are smarter than the people around them.

 

[Theuderic]

No I've never heard of Lawful Stupid but I get it. If you want to learn more about how D&D druids are then may I suggest that you talk to Gygax about this? He has a thread here at En World and I'm sure he would be happy to make sense of it for you. I understand it. It makes perfect sense to me. Nobody is going to hunt down the druids. I don't think they could find them. People are largly ignorant of the druids main aim when it comes to the world at large and they definately don't advertise anything.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

If you want to learn more about how D&D druids are

I think I see the core of our argument. For one thing, I don't think there's any such thing as "how things are" in D&D. There's the "way things are" at each individual table and in each of our minds. You can play your way, and I can play mine.

I prefer something closer to the Celtic druids that actually existed (even if I have to base that on bastardized legends and Caesar's journals).

Whereas, you're in favor of Gygax' druids, which bear little or no ethical and philosophic resemblance to anything that was actually called a druid in the real world, IMO.

Of course, it's a game, so this isn't exactly a burning issue, either way.

 

[Theuderic]

Arguement? hmmmm.....how revealing.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

Arguement? hmmmm.....how revealing.

Not sure what's revealing about that. We were having a discussion in which we expressed differing opinions of druidic philosophy. That's an argument. (In the context of making an argument a la debate, rather than the screaming and shouting at each other "argument")

 

[Theuderic]

Canis I think I've got you figured out my friend. The "core" is going to go play D&D now. NO hard feelings? Put er there.....

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

Canis I think I've got you figured out my friend.

Heck, I haven't got me figured out. If you could supply some clues...

But definitely, no hard feelings. Never had any. I can disagree with someone without having anything of the kind. In fact, I rather enjoy honest disagreement.

 

[wolff96]

If a group of people show a tendency to follow an agenda I can't comprehend which involves them switching allies, I'm going to stop trusting them. They keep doing it over a long enough period of time, and someone's going to decide that they are too unpredictable to be anything but an enemy. And since the enemy you know is infinitely preferable to the one you can't figure out, it becomes time to exterminate the druids.

If you ever read "Villains by Necessity" by Eve Forward (I think) then you'll find an author who agrees with you.

There's only one druid left. They helped Good when the Evil was overwhelming the world, then they switched to aid Evil when the Good forces got close to defeating the Evil. Then they were stuck in the middle and annihilated to the point where only one was left.

And she sides with villains to go release evil back into the world to bring back the badly upset balance in the world.

Good book.

---------------------------------

On druids -- I can only speak for mine. He is a believer in civilization and the cautious and limited exploitation of natural resources. Careful mining, renewable resources -- such as plant-based materials where possible -- and replanting when an area has been logged.

Of course, he also has a lot in common with your average force of nature... it takes a lot of time for him to get angry, but he tends to use (as another player put it) "completely massive overkill beyond any recognition" when he does reach the boiling point.

And he's True Neutral -- a soul striving for balance.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

On druids -- I can only speak for mine. He is a believer in civilization and the cautious and limited exploitation of natural resources. Careful mining, renewable resources -- such as plant-based materials where possible -- and replanting when an area has been logged.

Of course, he also has a lot in common with your average force of nature... it takes a lot of time for him to get angry, but he tends to use (as another player put it) "completely massive overkill beyond any recognition" when he does reach the boiling point.

And he's True Neutral -- a soul striving for balance.

Sounds like my kind of druid. Except that I'd describe what you said as good, not neutral (unless he goes on obscene murderous rampages when he finally gets upset).

Not to derail this to an alignment issue, but I this is just another one of those places where alignment descriptions fail me. IMO, balance is good. Balance is a sustainable state that is to the benefit of all living things. Sounds good to me.