WotC Dungeons & Dragons Fans Seek Removal of Oriental Adventures From Online Marketplace

[Chaosmancer]

On every older WoTC product in the DMS Guild right now:

"We recognize that some of the legacy content available on this website, does not reflect the values of the Dungeon & Dragons franchise today. Some older content may reflect ethnic, racial and gender prejudice that were commonplace in American society at that time. These depictions were wrong then and are wrong today. This content is presented as it was originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed. Dungeons & Dragons teaches that diversity is a strength, and we strive to make our D&D products as welcoming and inclusive as possible. This part of our work will never end."

Well, glad to see that they are taking action.

Simplicity, mostly.

When the enemies are the same creature types as the PCs then said PCs are faced with a choice: either go full-on murderhobo and kill 'em all anyway or start having to sort through them and by whatever means determine which ones are worth saving and which aren't (or failing that, somehow get them all back to town so the local authorities can look after it).

Far simpler just to be able to say "There's Orcs in those woods; and if you meet one in there either you or it ain't coming out." That said, if the PCs go in and meet one and decide they want to talk to it rather than fight it, cool.

Slightly pendantic, but they all do share the same creature type anyways. Humanoid.

And, that being said, a party full of humans encountering a war band of dwarves is of course going to react very differently than if they encountered Orcs right? So, it isn't so much encountering a different race of beings, but it is encountering the ones labeled evil and savage.


And hey, look, I get simplicity. I honestly do. But, you can have simplicity without needing a race of bad guys. A typical orc is CR 1/2. Other low CR enemies that can convey the same simplicity.

Beasts (everything from bears to wolves to giant spiders and crocs)
Cultists of demons or devils
Blights
Low Level demons and Devils
Fungus and other plants
Ghouls, Zombies, Skeletons and other undead
Magmin and Mephits
Scarecrows and other constructs

All I really didn't include was anything with the humanoid tag (excluding the cultists) because I already covered that. You could have elven bandits, dwarven war profiteers, ect ect ect. And having orcs be a playable race does not prevent them from the same stories that those races share.

 

[Lanefan]

Slightly pendantic, but they all do share the same creature type anyways. Humanoid.

'Creature type' is my replacement term for 'race'.

 

[Mistwell]

'Creature type' is my replacement term for 'race'.

You mean something like:

Creature Type: Humanoid (High Elf)

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

You mean something like:

Creature Type: Humanoid (High Elf)

So on a world where humans are not known and elves are the dominant species, would it be Creature Type: Elfoid (Mountain Dwarf)?

 

[Mercurius]

So on a world where humans are not known and elves are the dominant species, would it be Creature Type: Elfoid (Mountain Dwarf)?

More like:

Creature Type: Degenerate Quasi-Elfoid (Mountain Dwarf)

 

[Dire Bare]

Does the fact that they're using the same language make it less relevant, or weaken the message? Looks pretty solid to me, and exactly what I'd expect them to do.

Plagiarism is generally frowned upon in the publishing business.

Still, the message is a good one. I'm happy.

 

[Dire Bare]

I was surprised they put it on every single thing from 4th edition back. Does WB put it on every DVD regardless of the content if its 10 years old or older? Or do they judge based on the disc content?

Considering we still have legacy issues in 5th Edition . . . they might want to slap that disclaimer on all current products as well!!

 

[Aldarc]

Interesting article on why "Avatar: The Last Airbender" works as Asian-inspired fantasy written by white guys . . . . a focus on history rather than stereotypes. And before critiquing, please actually READ the article and note that the author is Asian.

Some of my thoughts after reading: "Avatar" is story-focused, with excellent world-building, where D&D sourcebooks, like OA (1E), tend to focus on the world-building (based on stereotypes), leaving the story-telling to the players. Part of the nature of D&D at the time, perhaps even now, but something to keep in mind for those wishing to create some Asian-inspired fantasy in the D&D space.

Thanks for the link. I was thinking about Avatar as well, since I've been watching that lately.

Similarly when thinking about the "But D&D is supposed to be a pastiche of cultures," I've also been considering starting a discussion on brilliant settings like Tékumel - which to the best of my knowledge has nowhere near the level of accusations of racism, even if we adjust comparative levels of exposure between it and OA - and why certain cultural pastiches of non-Western cultures work while others don't.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Considering we still have legacy issues in 5th Edition . . . they might want to slap that disclaimer on all current products as well!!

Then DrivethruRPG may as well slap it onto most everything sold there, D&D or not. After all, TSR/WotC is not the only company guilty of all this.

 

[Dire Bare]

Thanks for the link. I was thinking about Avatar as well, since I've been watching that lately.

Similarly when thinking about the "But D&D is supposed to be a pastiche of cultures," I've also been considering starting a discussion on brilliant settings like Tékumel - which to the best of my knowledge has nowhere near the level of accusations of racism, even if we adjust comparative levels of exposure between it and OA - and why certain cultural pastiches of non-Western cultures work while others don't.

Tekumel has its own issues with orientalism . . . . but remains a fascinating setting. It's been a while since I've read up on it, so no deets on any criticism of Barker's fantasy setting, sorry.