WotC Dungeons & Dragons Fans Seek Removal of Oriental Adventures From Online Marketplace

[Cadence]

One thing I find interesting about all this, is that some people with whom I've disagreed with over these issues fail to realise how rediculously unimportant these window dressing changes are to the true issues which exist out there.

Multi-tasking is a thing.

 

[Sadras]

If they are ridiculously unimportant, why are you arguing about them?

Rediculously unimportant compared to the real issues which exist.
Not rediculously unimportant to me. I'm not a fan of censorship.

 

[Sadras]

Multi-tasking is a thing.

This isn't multitasking. This is absurdity.
Have you even watched the video or do you just accept anything told to you?

 

[Retreater]

Most libraries purge books a lot if they aren't checked out. I sometimes wonder how bad I am for once in a while checking out some by my favorite authors just so I can return them to keep them on the shelves :-/

Yes. That's one of our guidelines we use. One of the library standards for weeding books is called the CREW method (Continuous Review, Evaluation, and Weeding). The method is not just looking at circulation statistics, but also publication dates for material, assuming that older material may not be useful (and might have erroneous and potential dangerous information in areas such as science and medicine). Another category (in addition to publication date and general patron usage) is the acronym [Misleading, Ugly, Superseded, Trivial, Irrelevant, Elsewhere available].
With space at a premium these days, libraries can't hold on to things forever. We need space for Maker Labs, 3D printers, interactive play spaces for children, and more.
I would argue (completely from a librarian's perspective), that OA from 1e or 3e would be "superseded" by the 5e rules system products. I would not hang on to it in a general public library setting.

 

[Tallifer]

Dennis Laffey's "Chanbara" and "Flying Swordsman" are better D&D games anyways.

 

[Dire Bare]

Is the term “Oriental” offensive outside the USA/North America? Is a North American sensibility the proper one to apply here? Where North American mores conflict with European or Asian mores, how do we respectfully weigh all considerations? Does the location of the publisher matter? Does the physical location of most of the customers matter?

D&D has a worldwide audience, and that's a good thing. But it IS primarily an American game written by Americans for a primarily American audience. So, in context of this discussion, who cares if "oriental" is only offensive to folks in America? We shouldn't be using the term in D&D.

And even if D&D was written and designed from a more global perspective, with writers and designers from all over the world contributing . . . if "oriental" was only found offensive in one large area of the world, why wouldn't WotC still avoid use of the term?

In our other recent discussions we talked about blackface and how super-taboo it is in the U.S., but not so much in other parts of the world that have different experiences and history. So, since blackface is only super-taboo in the U.S. does that make it okay to incorporate into D&D? Of course not.

 

[Aldarc]

This isn't multitasking. This is absurdity.
Have you even watched the video or do you just accept anything told to you?

Do you only ask this question to people who disagree with you?

 

[Bagpuss]

You know, no one ever felt the need to bring up how racist Faerun and all their European views are until we started pointing out that the OA was problematic for people.

But, if it leads to the game being more inclusive and less hurtful to the greeks for the use of their hydra, then I guess we can talk about changing that after we change the OA

No one is bringing up how racist Faerun is (it isn't) they are pointing out if you treat Asia the same as you've treated Europe, that isn't being racist. If you treat both cultures by the same method of cherry picking the cool weapons, armour and myths and ignoring the bits of culture you don't find useful to the heroic adventure stories you want to tell with D&D, then it isn't racist. It is just how you treat the source material in general, you take all the cool interesting naughty word you find and throw it in a blender and there's your setting.

Applying different methods to Asia than Europe would be racists, treating both cultures in the same way isn't. It isn't an issue to cherry pick with Europe and it isn't an issue to then do the same with Asia.

 

[Sadras]

The best thing would be to get some real, fairly accurate portrayals of myths and monsters and cultures, because they can be fascinating.

PoP culturism is also fascinating. I didn't know we were now striving for realism and accuracy within D&D.
Cannot wait for you to start the petition to rename the Medusa a Gorgon.

 

[Sadras]

Do you only ask this question to people who disagree with you?

Aldarc I'd be happy to discuss the offending material like it was analysed with orcs and vistani.
Please highlight the issues that are the cause of offense.