Dungeon's new pirates of the caribbean series

[Hussar]

Get over it. I suppose your ire is fed by the "pseudo-medieval" misnomer attached to D&D. Except the swords and the use of armor, D&D is distinctively set in the 19th century. You can see this also from common depictions of interiors, equipment lists, house maps or city maps. Just forget that "medieval" word .

As for the "Savage Tide" campaign, it looks like a compelling story . I also liked the illustrations very much.

I can live with a lot of anachronisms. I'm not a history fetishist.

However, gun ports? I mean, come on. How hard would it be to take those off the side of the picture?

Just because it has sails does NOT make it good for DnD. If I'm playing Buccaneers and Bokor, then fine, no problems. A sloop would be slightly advanced, but, not too bad. But, compare what you see in the DMG.

The most advanced ship in the DMG is a cog. 11th century. No worries.

A sloop is an 18th century ship. It was used well into the 19th century.

Like I said, I'm not a huge history buff. However, it's very jarring to see ships that are SO out of place. There are some really cool looking earlier era ships anyway, so, why use something that's a couple of decades away from the Luisitania? I could easily live with carracks - Santa Maria style ships - or that sort of thing.

Galleons and newer ships really jar things for me. Sure, it's a great picture, but that's not the point. We're not talking about a buckle fetish. I can live with that, after all, there's no reason that a non-human fantasy culture couldn't have a buckle fetish. The technology for making buckles isn't all that out of line with what you find in the PHB. No worries. Heck, dungeon punk doesn't faze me in the slightest. It's fantasy.

But to build a sloop or any other ship of a similar period requires a VERY high technological level that typically doesn't exist in a fantasy setting. And, again, gun ports? Why does my ship have gun ports when I DON'T HAVE GUNS!?

This is a case of the artists being too bloody lazy to pick up a history book and learning to draw something because they assume the readers are too stupid to know any history.

 

[Glyfair]

And, again, gun ports? Why does my ship have gun ports when I DON'T HAVE GUNS!?

Where do you think the wizards are stationed to cast their "artillery" spells? I'm pretty sure the medieval war ships didn't have to consider that in their design. I don't see why they wouldn't be placed in similar positions to the cannons. They might not have the exact designs, but I don't see why the D&D artists need to sit down and reinvent the wheel just for a picture.

 

[Hussar]

Where do you think the wizards are stationed to cast their "artillery" spells? I'm pretty sure the medieval war ships didn't have to consider that in their design. I don't see why they wouldn't be placed in similar positions to the cannons. They might not have the exact designs, but I don't see why the D&D artists need to sit down and reinvent the wheel just for a picture.

So, your ships carry 24 artillery wizards? Twelve broadside gun ports, not much higher than the waterline. Yeah, that's a good place for wizards. Put them where they can't see as far.

Gimme a break. Why wouldn't you put a castle on the fore deck for wizards? I think I would want my wizards to be able to see up as well as out considering the number of flying opponents.

The thing is, you're right Glyfair. They don't have to reinvent the wheel. You are 100% exactly correct. What they have to do is use a ship that is in keeping with the time frame of DnD instead of something that is about 400 years out of line.

I wonder how many people would defend artists depicting Napoleonic orcs in the Caves of Chaos?

There are any number of ships that could be used for inspiration for a DND game. However, for some reason, artists pick up the easiest one to find and then figure that no one else will know the difference.

 

[Wik]

I'm with you on this, Hussar. There are plenty of ships that could be useful in the D&D world - Viking Longships, the Arabic Dhows, or even Byzantine Dromonds are all era-specific ships that would translate well into D&D.

I guess when people think "naval adventure", though, they think pirates of the caribbean... and that means 1600 onwards ship design.

 

[happyelf]

I agree the gun ports are a bit much, it's kinda like if an artist drew an adventurer with a powder horn strapped to his backpack.

 

[Hussar]

The thing is, a ship like this:

would be perfectly fine. It's a 15th century carrack. Cover over those four gun ports and it's groovy. Maybe a tad late, but, certainly not too bad. But, later ships are just so bloody BIG. A sloop carries around 100 crew. This is a HUGE ship compared to period ships. This thing would eat viking ships for breakfast. To give you an idea, Captain Cook sailed around the world in a sloop.

 

[happyelf]

I can see the appeal of big ships, not only are they in the pirates genre, but hey make for bigger floorplans and we are talking about dungeon magazine.

I would love a genuine re-imaging of the age of sail for D&D, I think there's a lot of potential there, despite the technology involved. I'm not normally a big fan of wierdo dungeonpunk high-magic ideas in settings, but I could see minor magic playing a role in the construction of ships.

Beyond that I think ships are pretty cool and could play a lot of roles. For instance in races of the wild I thought it was a shame that they only made brief mention of seaborne nomadic haflings, wich I thought was a pretty cool idea. I mean, halflings are half-sized, so effectivly that means their ships would be twice as big for them. A fleet of hafling ships could make very interesting use of the space they'd have.

 

[Turjan]

Galleons and newer ships really jar things for me. Sure, it's a great picture, but that's not the point. We're not talking about a buckle fetish. I can live with that, after all, there's no reason that a non-human fantasy culture couldn't have a buckle fetish. The technology for making buckles isn't all that out of line with what you find in the PHB. No worries. Heck, dungeon punk doesn't faze me in the slightest. It's fantasy.

See? That was my point. You get riled up about ship types. I don't see anyone getting second thoughts about room illustrations depicting someone wearing Civil War era clothing with paintings hanging on the walls, gas lamps and lots of other relatively modern trappings in the picture. Or maps of harbour cities that would be crushed to pieces by the first storm. Or distinctively 19th century city maps.

This is the point with gun ports. You might have ballistae behind them. I also prefer a bit more consistency in fantasy depictions, although I've given up on time consistency (whatever that means in a fantasy setting, where even city walls are sometimes questionable). I like logical consistency, though. If it's any consolation, the Dungeon preview didn't contain any ships with gun ports, if I recall it correctly.

 

[Turjan]

This is a HUGE ship compared to period ships. This thing would eat viking ships for breakfast. To give you an idea, Captain Cook sailed around the world in a sloop.

I know what you mean. I have seen the replica of Sir Francis Drake's "Golden Hind" in the harbour of Brixham, and I was asking myself how more than 100 people fit on that tiny ship. It's only 70 feet long and 19 feet wide.

 

[bastrak]

Except the swords and the use of armor, D&D is distinctively set in the 19th century. You can see this also from common depictions of interiors, equipment lists, house maps or city maps.

Er I don't think so. At least not in any D&D I have ever played.

The technology in the PHB equipment chapter is almost totally medieval.

I'd like to see ships that are at least vaguely historically accurate for the medieval period.