Dwarven kingdoms

[GMMichael]

Not exactly a full dwarven mine/community, but just a mine, but here's a map I did with a currently used map -

How great is this? Nice job, Michael!

I'll lay some blame on the Fantasy Father for dwarfs' permanent decline. I'll admit, it wasn't until I saw a trailer for some console game (maybe Dragon Age?), in which a bald dwarf answers some questions in a dimly lit room, that I said to myself, "wait, why must dwarfs have beards?"

It was all downhill from there. Underhill, if you will.

 

[tuxgeo]

Mythology:

. . .
"Very few beings explicitly identifiable as dwarfs appear in the Poetic Edda and Prose Edda and have quite diverse roles: murderous creators who create the mead of poetry, 'reluctant donors' of important artifacts with magical qualities, or sexual predators who lust after goddesses.[5] They are primarily associated with metalsmithing, and also with death; as in the story of King Sveigðir in Ynglinga saga, the first segment of the Heimskringla, the doorways in the mountains that they guard may be regarded as doors between worlds.[6] One dwarf, Alvíss, claimed the hand of the god Thor's daughter Þrúðr in marriage, but when kept talking until daybreak, turned to stone much like some accounts of trolls.[7]"
. . .

So they guard the doorways in the mountains -- much as the soldiers of a mountain kingdom might. This is long before Tolkien.

Oddly, the old Northern myths seem to confuse dwarfs with trolls. (They would make good jokesters: "the Drolls.")
In Peer Gynt, the "Mountain King" is listed as a troll; but the word "dwarf" might also have been applicable to him.

 

[Vicente]

I seem to remember the Dwarven cities in Dragon Age were on its prime (fuzzy memories, I may be wrong). I think that's the case also in Warcraft.

 

[tomBitonti]

WHFRP dwarves are in serious decline: Most of their Karaks are overtaken by Skaven or Orcs. In PathFinder, only a few of the Sky Citadels are still occupied by dwarves, the rest in ruins or occupied by monsters.

Thx!

TomB

 

[Voadam]

I concur that WFRP dwarves are in decline as are the Pathfinder Golarion dwarves. WFRP ones were big world players but had clashes with the elves and greenskins that wore away their prominence and numbers.

Forgotten Realms dwarves were in decline in 1e and 2e with lost cities like Under Illefarn but in 3e they gave them the Thunder Blessing which increased their numbers and lead to a bit of a resurgence.

In Goodman Games DCC 35 Gazetteer of the Known Realms the campaign setting history has a past age be one of elves and dwarves being prominent empires of the world that have fallen, leading to the current age of Man.

In the Scarred Lands Burok Torn is a huge active dwarven undermountain city filled with some of the world's best wizards is being worn away by war on two fronts against a LE human empire and against dark elves from below.

In Ptolus the grailwarden dwarves were once the big partners to the human empire providing guns but their numbers are down and they are in decline and the Stonelost ones were driven from their homes under Ptolus by dark elves.

Bucking the trend along with Eathdawn's Throal is Mayfair Games' AD&D Dwarves sourcebook. It presents a dwarven city in a mountain that is active and thriving.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

I've been re-reading the Lord of the Rings, and just last night I was reading through the council of Elrond chapter. Apparently they created a thriving dwarven kingdom under the lonely mountain after they took it back from Smaug. Also, it seems there are a lot of dwarves travelling all the time. More than humans is the impression you get. So even in Tolkien there are thriving dwarven kingdoms in the current storyline.

On a side note, I've decided that I think the movies are better. The book reads like a spruced up account of an RPG campaign. The protagonists are frequently experiencing delays that have nothing much to add to the plot, pittering around getting their stuff together before continuing their journeys, ending up having less interesting encounters when better ones are begging to be had (like fighting the ringwraiths in a little hollow at the base of Weathertop, rather than right on top like in the movie) and generally doing a lot of things that make for a better immersive world experience than actual story.

 

[gamerprinter]

On a side note, I've decided that I think the movies are better. The book reads like a spruced up account of an RPG campaign. The protagonists are frequently experiencing delays that have nothing much to add to the plot, pittering around getting their stuff together before continuing their journeys, ending up having less interesting encounters when better ones are begging to be had (like fighting the ringwraiths in a little hollow at the base of Weathertop, rather than right on top like in the movie) and generally doing a lot of things that make for a better immersive world experience than actual story.

Strange, in that The One Ring RPG which most claim most closely cleaves to the Lord of the Rings as an RPG, has for its emphasis the long and arduous journey between locations with roleplay, and combat are under emphasized in that game. So apparently the publisher of the One Ring and its fans think the complete opposite to your point. The pittering around and continuing on journeys, is the point to Lord of the Rings story with events like Weathertop, Mines of Moria as highlights to the game that is mostly about the journey. Doing it how you suggest is more like D&D, and nothing like the real Lord of the Rings. Its strange because many fans say the One Ring is an excellent adaption of Tolkien's works as an RPG, thus more like the books and less like the movies. It seems both fans and publisher favor conditions opposite to your point.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

Strange, in that The One Ring RPG which most claim most closely cleaves to the Lord of the Rings as an RPG, has for its emphasis the long and arduous journey between locations with roleplay, and combat are under emphasized in that game. So apparently the publisher of the One Ring and its fans think the complete opposite to your point. The pittering around and continuing on journeys, is the point to Lord of the Rings story with events like Weathertop, Mines of Moria as highlights to the game that is mostly about the journey. Doing it how you suggest is more like D&D, and nothing like the real Lord of the Rings. Its strange because many fans say the One Ring is an excellent adaption of Tolkien's works as an RPG, thus more like the books and less like the movies. It seems both fans and publisher favor conditions opposite to your point.

Yeah, basically what I'm saying is that the books seem more like simulationist RPGs than narrativist stories (compared to the movies). Again demonstrating that my tastes change drastically based on format. In D&D, I really want simulationism. I'd probably love the One Ring if is supports that style of play (although in most non-D&D RPGs I prefer narrativism). In a story, however, I really want narrativism. The Lord of the Rings movies are very narrativist--like almost all movies. They give us story now, highlight the most interesting and exciting points, and skip scene to where we want to be. The exact same format is followed in the majority of modern books, just stretched out a bit.

I'm enough a product of modern entertainment that I don't want to read/watch someone else's RPG campaign as primary recreation. I'd rather play the books, but I'd rather read the movies.

 

[DrunkonDuty]

Of course what no one has dared say is that we WANT the Dwarven realms to fail and fall.
It gives us immense dungeons full of monsters and traps to explore.
If we want to save the Dwarves we have to change our own attitudes first!

 

[Lwaxy]

Or we could just say the dwarves went on to new pastures and forgot to close shop

The German fantasy stories usually have their dwarf realms intact.