ECL vs CR

[DungeonmasterCal]

Ok...undoubtedly this has been addressed before, so please excuse the re-posting of this query.

For simplicity's sake, let's say I have two players; a 1st level swashbuckler and a 1st level warmage. The warmage is a homebrew race that gives a player character an ECL of +1. My question is this:

When figuring XP at the end of an adventure, do I count them both as 1st level characters, or is the ECL+1 character figured as though it were level 2?

Thanks!

 

[Nail]

The "warmage is ECL (Equivalent Character Level) 2. Meaning he is treated as a 2nd level PC.....including XP.

BTW, the ECL 2 PC needs more experience to get to his next level that the ECL 1 PC. You know about that, right?

 

[DungeonmasterCal]

Yup, I knew about that.... I was just kinda fuzzy on the level/ECL thing, and didn't have time to hunt it down on the SRD... Thanks!!

 

[devilish]

The "warmage is ECL (Equivalent Character Level) 2. Meaning he is treated as a 2nd level PC.....including XP.

BTW, the ECL 2 PC needs more experience to get to his next level that the ECL 1 PC. You know about that, right?

Ok - I need a wee bit of help on this : Assuming the following:

LEVEL XP
1 0
2 1,000
3 3,000

Does the 1st Level WarMage start with 1000xp and need 2000xp to go to 2nd Level? As opposed to our 1st lvl character who just needs 1000xp to go to 2nd level.

Or does he need 3000xp to go to 2nd level?

Thanks,
-D

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

He needs 3,000 XP to get to 2nd level.

 

[Coredump]

He needs 3,000 XP to get to 2nd level.

I don't think so. The SRD says to treat it as if you were multiclassing. So a Rogue1/fighter1 needs2K to get to the next level. A Race1/fighter1 would need 2k to get to the next level.

Otherwise they will *quickly* get *way* outdistanced.

The HD/LA is supposed to make them balanced against other classes. So lets look at something that is high. An HD and LA total of +8 (say a 'Grogan")

A fighter9 needs 9k to get to the next level
A Grogan8/fighter1, by your logic, would need 46K

That means the fighter9 would become a fighter13 *before* the Grogan ever went up a level. That does not jibe with the HD+LA is supposed to be balanced with class level. A fighter13 should be equal to a Grogan8/fighter5.

.

 

[Lamoni]

Does the 1st Level WarMage start with 1000xp and need 2000xp to go to 2nd Level? As opposed to our 1st lvl character who just needs 1000xp to go to 2nd level.

Or does he need 3000xp to go to 2nd level?

Thanks,
-D

He would start with 1000xp since he is ECL 2, so it would be unfair to all the other characters that had to start at level 1. Therefore races with level adjustments generally aren't allowed in campaigns that start at level 1. And if you start at level 2, you can't select a race with a LA above +1, etc. Of course that is all up to the DM since there is no rule saying you can't start with a party that are all different levels.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I don't think so. The SRD says to treat it as if you were multiclassing. So a Rogue1/fighter1 needs2K to get to the next level. A Race1/fighter1 would need 2k to get to the next level.

For a grand total of 3,000 experience points.

 

[Silveras]

I don't think so. The SRD says to treat it as if you were multiclassing. So a Rogue1/fighter1 needs2K to get to the next level. A Race1/fighter1 would need 2k to get to the next level.

Otherwise they will *quickly* get *way* outdistanced.

The HD/LA is supposed to make them balanced against other classes. So lets look at something that is high. An HD and LA total of +8 (say a 'Grogan")

A fighter9 needs 9k to get to the next level
A Grogan8/fighter1, by your logic, would need 46K

That means the fighter9 would become a fighter13 *before* the Grogan ever went up a level. That does not jibe with the HD+LA is supposed to be balanced with class level. A fighter13 should be equal to a Grogan8/fighter5.

.

Actually, that is phrased badly; it is clarified in the rest of the section. A creature with a Level Adjustment entry is one the designers considered workable to take levels in a class. Actually taking those levels makes the creature "like a multi-class".

Experience for Monsters: A monster with Hit Dice of 1 or less, no level adjustment, and class levels uses the same tables as standard PC races when determining experience needed.

A monster with Hit Dice of 1 or less, a level adjustment, and class levels adds its class levels and level adjustment together when determining experience needed (class level + level adjustment).

A monster with more than one Hit Die, a level adjustment, and class levels adds its Hit Dice, class levels, and level adjustment together when determining experience needed (HD + level adjustment + class level).

So, a Human (LA: 0) who becomes a fighter "trades in" the Humanoid d8 for the Fighter's d10. His ECL is : 0 [Monster HD] + 1 [Class Level] + 0 [LA] = 1

A humanoid race with a LA of +1, though is:
0 [Monster HD] + 1 [Class Level] + 1 [LA] = a 2nd level character.

This is why one of the variant rules in Unearthed Arcana exists. As time goes by, that +1 becomes less of an equalizer and more of just a plain penalty. So, there is an option to "buy off" the adjustment by permanently sacrificing XP when the character reaches 3rd level.

 

[Coredump]

For a grand total of 3,000 experience points.

No. The question was very specific. It asked if he had 1K and needed 2K.
Or if he needed 3K.

You said he needed 3K. While possible to twist it semantically, it clearly gave the wrong answer to the question as asked.

.