[Edited] Brotherhood of the Wolf: Martial arts out of place?

[blackshirt5]

I absolutely loathe BotW. I hated it from the Xena extras passing as villagers, to the "all Native Americans are in touch with nature" nonsense, to the kung-fu Native American, to "I'm angry so I now posess kung-fu powers" French guy, to the not really a monster monster.

So, is it safe to say that you didn't like the movie?

And we only saw one Native American in the movie, Mani. To be fair, it didn't say "all native americans are in touch with nature", it said "Mani is in touch with nature".

 

[Rackhir]

The thing that struck me the most was how clumsy the editing for the combat sequences was. During a number of the fights, especially the last one. You could only see the chest/torso of the combatants, with the heads and most of the legs chopped off. It really seemed to me like it was their first attempt at doing a martial-arts/action film and they just didn't know how to shoot the sequences.

 

[takyris]

I liked it -- but then, I'm a sucker for cross-genre movies.

And the fighting is just a style. I mean, if the movie were trying to be realistic, it wouldn't have swashbuckling European fights, either -- it'd have someone lunging forward and someone else making an awkward attempt to parry and getting slashed on the arm and screaming and then lunging in and the two of them wrestling until somebody could get their knife out and gut the other guy. It'd be, ya know, a real fight.

So really, if the cinematography is going to be non-realistic, I'd rather it be non-realistic and fun to watch, too.

Like The Musketeer... man, that movie was AWFUL, but it had great Hong Kong takes on every cliche in the swashbuckling book. Because I was watching it on DVD with my wife, we could just laugh out loud and make jokes about how bad Dude's acting was (I don't know the actor's real name; we just started calling him Dude, as in "Duuuuude, I'm totally rescuing the queen!") and then laugh in delight at some of the more interesting fight scenes (and still have some howlers: "Yes, you're charging a castle filled with guards using rifles. Draw your swords now, that's definitely the smartest thing to do...").

 

[Hand of Evil]

I liked it and I did not find the martial arts out of place. Sauve (sp) and Boxing would have been about, plus it is very believable that a warrior culture would have some form of hand to hand combat, maybe it would not have been the stylisted art of Asia but there would have been something, the Spartians were know for having ways to kill with their bare hands. It is plausable.

 

[Kahuna Burger]

So, is it safe to say that you didn't like the movie?

And we only saw one Native American in the movie, Mani. To be fair, it didn't say "all native americans are in touch with nature", it said "Mani is in touch with nature".

And mani was IIRC described straight out as a 'holy man' of some sort. A far cry from having anything to say about "all native americans".

The film was up and down for me. to be honest I totally lost the plot at one point and couldn't figure out if we were having a flashback or not, and the romance seemed a little "just so" rather than actually feeling right to me... but there were definatly good bits, and fun characters.

Kahuna Burger

 

[barsoomcore]

I'll pitch in on the "Up and Down" bandwagon. Some bits were pretty cool while it was slow in other parts, and then it had Monica Bellucci and after that I kinda forgot everything else that was going on....

Bonus points for the armour-plated lion, Monica Bellucci, the big spiked log going slow-motion past Mani, extend-o sword, Monica Bellucci, tri-corner hats (everything is cooler with a tri-corner hat), pretty cinematography and um, Monica Bellucci.

Minus points for some crappy fight editing, not putting enough imagination into the combat styles and sequences, stuttery pacing and not enough Monica Bellucci.

I agree that Asian martial arts have really taken over cinema and am looking forward to seeing some new styles and choreography on the screen. I'd like to see realistic fights that are simultaneously exciting, and unrealistic fights that show a little inventiveness and thought (especially with regards to use of props and scenery -- nobody can really touch Jackie Chan in this department, but I'd like to see a little more effort there, people).

My thoughts.

 

[Villano]

And we only saw one Native American in the movie, Mani. To be fair, it didn't say "all native americans are in touch with nature", it said "Mani is in touch with nature".

And mani was IIRC described straight out as a 'holy man' of some sort. A far cry from having anything to say about "all native americans".

But, aren't they all holy men in movies? I'm just pointing out the fact that most Native Americans that show up in film tend to be like Mani, even movies set in modern times. If you see a Native American on screen, chances are he's going to be say something about visions or spirit animals. The one in this film happened to be named "Mani".

All I know is that I've never held a conversation with a tree. Perhaps that's because I'm only part Native American. Maybe if I wasn't, white wolves would come down from the mountains and reveal the secrets of the universe to me. As it stands, the closest I've gotten to that are the deer and occasional bear which run through my yard.

So, is it safe to say that you didn't like the movie?

IIRC, Ebert described the movie as is a genre factory exploded; there are bits and pieces of all sorts of different films mixed in here. He actually enjoyed it, I didn't. It's okay to combine genres, but, to me, BotW was like a bad Hong Kong film; lots of things were tossed in together because they were "cool" (kung-fu Xena French villagers), but done poorly.

 

[demiurge1138]

Andy Collins statted up stuff from Brotherhood of the Wolf, including the sword, here.

And his opinion influenced the 3.5 MM, too. With people on this thread being reminded of the howler or krenshar by the Beast, the link says that Andy Collins thinks it should be statted as a dire lion. And then, in the 3.5 MM with its new italicized descriptions, what do we get for the dire lion? "This monstrous creature has bony protrusions around its eyes and shoulders, with spiked ridges running along the length of its back." Hmm...

The martial arts were a little but anachronistic, but that doesn't mean I didn't like them. I thought that they helped the movie, albeit in a stylized, wierd way (and it was a stylized, wierd movie).

Demiurge out.

 

[reapersaurus]

In a movie like BotW, I couldn't give two cares about whether the fighting styles are appropriate for the time.

It's an action-monster-movie, for gawds sake.

As for the original French, usually I'd say 'watch the movie in the original language', but with BotW, the English dub was done by the original actors, who also speak English, I believe, so IMO the English language track didn't lose anything.

In fact, watch the movie closely from the beginning, and it's probably 10 minutes in before the language is even an issue - long spots of no dialogue.

The extra oomph the story (easier to follow, less detachment, more cohesiveness) gets watching the movie in English also outweighs the minor loss of original flavor the French dialogue gains.

 

[danzig138]

All I know is that I've never held a conversation with a tree.

You just have not met the right tree.