Eladrin trance - 'waking' penalty?

[Nahat Anoj]

My group has ruled no penalty. But as the eladrin, I feel a bit guilty (seems a pretty powerful perk) and wonder whether this is correct. I've been unable to find any official - or otherwise! - clarification. How do most of you rule on this?

No penalty. Warforged have a similar trait, and when Dark Sun comes out the thri-kreen will have it too.

According to RAW, there are no penalties for never taking an extended rest. In theory, PCs can stay awake for weeks on end and suffer no ill effects (other than not being able to replenish healing surges or daily powers, of course). So it's not that huge of an advantage IMO.

 

[Narluin]

What's the penalty for waking up from sleep?

Hmm... good question. When flipping through the PHB a couple weeks ago, I thought I had read about a penalty for being woken up by an ally, which I imagined represented a period of sluggishness that I'd think would be comparable to drawing oneself out of a trance. I'm at work now and can't find it anywhere on the D&D Compendium... maybe I imagined it and the whole issue is moot!

 

[Mad Hamish]

I agree with everyone else. No penalty.

Unless you count the fact that you get to man EVERY watch during an extended rest a penalty. And if something sneaks up on the party IT'S YOUR FAULT! (Unless you know the "Shift Blame" ritual.)

My Elven ranger gets that anyway.

Even when asleep she's got the best perception in the party.

 

[Stalker0]

The penalty for sleep is the -5 to perception checks and being unconscious until waking up. Of course, for most people they would also be prone.

To me, this is a stealth benefit of eladrin, one that duly need. I allow eladrin to be completely aware while trancing. They are ready to fight at a moment's notice.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

I would agree {again} with Stalker0.

However, IMC I would also rule that since the trance is an out of combat issue, facing comes into play.
Otherwize everyone would hire Eladrin to 'sleep' on guard duty....

 

[Nytmare]

However, IMC I would also rule that since the trance is an out of combat issue, facing comes into play.

I'd rule that as a contributing factor of what was rolled, not of the difficulty.

You made it? You hear/see/smell/whatever the bad guy.

You didn't? It's because he was sneaky/behind you/down wind.

 

[Nifft]

The penalty for sleep is the -5 to perception checks and being unconscious until waking up. Of course, for most people they would also be prone.

Tieflings sleep hanging from a rafter by their horns. Doing this grants combat advantage, and it requires a Move action to disengage.

To me, this is a stealth benefit of eladrin, one that duly need. I allow eladrin to be completely aware while trancing. They are ready to fight at a moment's notice.

Eladrin do not sleep. They wait.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Garthanos]

Otherwize everyone would hire Eladrin to 'sleep' on guard duty....

I assumed they did...or that Warforged were hired or that people learned the Trance Ritual to do it themselves ...

Alah if there is no penalty to perception then there is NO penalty to perception...

 

[Flipguarder]

yeah do what you want in your campaigns, but if you penalize perception in anyway you are houseruling. Don't try to fit it into a reasonable interpretation cuz it dont.

 

[Narluin]

Eladrin do not sleep. They wait.

That seems to be the general consensus, but I think it's a bit of a biased interpretation of the trance description. Eladrin may be fey, but they're not robots waiting for some event to trigger a reflex reaction!

I don't think the trance description means the eladrin is simply sitting motionless for four hours, waiting for something to happen and ready to jump at the first sign, and getting the full benefits of an extended rest at the end. No, they didn't call it a trance for nothing. (Edit: why didn't they just call it 'Extended Wait' if that's what it is?) The OED defines a trance as, 'a sleeplike or half-conscious state without response to stimuli.'

I think we can agree that you (IRL) have some awareness of your surroundings when dozing (in a sleeplike state), and certainly the half-conscious bit of the definition implies this; but it also says you're without response to stimuli. And what exactly is the eladrin doing when in the trance? I imagine it's a very restful, dreamlike state in which he's still aware of his environment and can readily differentiate between what's happening in his trance state and the real world.

The eladrin may be 'fully aware' when in a trance, but, to me, that doesn't mean 'fully responsive'. If he decides to exit the trance, it shouldn't be instantaneous and should require a bit of effort to shake himself out; he should be a bit sluggish immediately afterwards.

All that said, this is somewhat of a moot thread - I thought the rules for waking from sleep covered a 'sluggish' -5 penalty to actions for a round or two after waking, but I obviously misread - the rules only state that you've a -5 penalty to perception WHEN sleeping to see whether you notice something's amiss and wake up.

I do find it strange that there isn't any penalty to actions immediately following waking up, but wouldn't wish a penalty on eladrin for exiting a trance if the other races don't have one from being woken up!