Elements of Magic errata and FAQ, 5-30-03

[BryonD]

Regarding the spell point vs. spell slot division, have you tried playing 3e psionics? A similar 'problem' happens, where a 14th level psion can use a 7th level power 6 times per day. If a psion tries to play like that, what happens is that he uses up his good powers quickly, perhaps kicking butt for a few rounds, but leaving him with little to fall back on if the party has multiple encounters in one day. The effect is that the character uses up his resources overly quickly, and it is quite noticeable if the party has multiple encounters in the same day (which seems to generally be encouraged by the 3e rules).

L14 Psion 87 points per day (124 if you use ITCK)
L14 EOM 142 points per day

And psions have far less flexibility. They, again, have FAR fewer powers (addressed further below). Their powers are constrained by multiple abilities. They have far fewer powers to choose from. And their powers are weaker.

L6 Sor casts L3 Spell Fireball: 6d6 damage (avg 21)
L6 Psion manifests L3 power whitefire 5d4 damage (avg 12.5)
L6 EOM cast L3 Evoke Area Fire: 5d6+6 damage (avg 23.5)
The EOM mage gets nearly two times to effect as the psion you are holding up for contrast.

L10 Sor casts L3 Spell Fireball: 10d6 damage (avg 35)
L10 Psion manifests L3 power whitefire 5d4 damage (avg 12.5)
L10 EOM cast L3 Evoke Area Fire: 5d6+10 damage (avg 27.5)
So now the EOM is more than 2X over the psion. The sorc is now about 20% ahead, but his advancement stops, he still knows WAY less spells and can produce significantly fewer of his highest level spells per day. (He also has 20 less skill points and has one moderate boon that is fixed to being a familiar, compared to two moderate and one minor boons that can be selected from a list.)

So, yes, I have played psionics. They work well.
Compared to an EOM mage they have FAR fewer powers, less flexibility, less power (points) and FAR less bang for their points.

Now, as to EOM mages not having 56 L7 spells a L14; I see your points, but they only go a very short way towards fixing the problem. For the sake of argurment, lets assume that only 10% of the spells are "good" and useful. I think the truth is closer to 75%, but I can make my case with 10%. OK, so you have 5 "real" L7 spells at L17. This compares to the sorcerers 1? 5 "real" L6 spells compared to the sorc's 2? You have to go down to L1 and L2 where The sorc has topped out at 5 to even be equal. So assuming 10%, the EOM mage has far to many spells avialabel to be considered balanced. Add in that 10% is a vast underestimation, and that the sorcerer is done getting spells below 4 and the comparison goes from worse to beyond.

 

[netnomad]

On a half-related note, have you ever played Talislanta? It's a great system, with a magic system somewhat similar to EOM (it's skill-based instead of level-based, but it's still close). In that system, spellcasters have access to even more versatility than EOM mages do, but they don't overshadow the non-magic-using characters. That's because magic has its drawbacks, and because a well-made warrior should be able to do more damage in combat than a wizard. The wizard just gets the flashy, useful abilities, the real magic of things like flight, shapeshifting, and seeing the future.

Oh yea, I really like that system and wish there was something like it for d20. I really like the idea that you use a skill check to cast spells and when you fail things go wrong. You can power up a spell but there is also a chance for failure and the more power you use the bigger the chance for failure.

The closest things that I have seem like this for d20 is Chaos Magic from Mongoose but it’s to complex to use “on the fly” and they don’t get you prepackaged spells like Talislanta.

Another thing I really like about the system is that magic has consequences. The more magic you used the more things go wrong... that type of thing.

Now, RW if you combine Wild Spellcraft, EoM and a Skill system I would buy one for everyone in my group and me!

I tinkered with this idea before but just could not get the mechanics “just” right. It was fun though. If anyone is interested in what I have done I can did it up and post the file.

-NetNomad

 

[Phaedrus]

I just wanted to say I'm glad you guys are back and are working on this. I really like EoM and look forward to the revisions and new version.

 

[Moonsword]

I'm also glad you guys are working on the revision. I run as a GM rather than as a player, and I've found EoM useful for throwing a monkey wrench at players. Give them a very exotic spellcaster, but make them NPC assistant, don't let 'em see the stats. That way, they don't know what they can and cannot do, but be consistentet. I ran a sorcerer-equivalent like this for a while. She was pretty useful, filled in for the AWOL arcane spellcasters and the missing cleric for spell versatility. No healing, but they had a druid. While the rules are occasionally a little... odd, they can make some incredible NPCs with some really strange powers, and flavor is something that can be played around with nearly endlessly.

 

[r-kelleg]

I'm in complete argeement with scholz's comments.
Moreover, as I already noticed in a previous thread, some spells are even stronger than original ones. For exemple, Fly can now be cast at the 2nd level. Zone effect spells can now be cast at the 1st one. This make the magic user too powerfull in comparison with other classes.
Unfortunately, nor the FAQ nor this looooooooooooooooong waited errata handled those problems.

 

[Cyberzombie]

Unfortunately, nor the FAQ nor this looooooooooooooooong waited errata handled those problems.

I'm sorry about the delay on things, but my now 10 month old baby came before the Elements of Magic. He's old enough now to not need quite such constant care, so I'm back on the case.

The changes we're making cover several areas, and are extensive enough that we just can't cover them in an FAQ/Errata format. We need to make things compatible with 3.5, which necessitates some major changes on a number of spells. We also need to reduce the power level of certain spells. As many of you have pointed out, some things ended up more powerful than they were intended to be.

I'm sorry for the delays, but I believe that the 3.5 update will be well worth it. I also believe that the sequel we're working on will also be well worth the wait.