Ending a quest with a last second steal from the players

[Omegaxicor]

I am curious whether ending a quest to recover an artefact (which is way above the party's level, 1, so they will expect it I think) with someone swooping in and stealing it from the player's grasp is too...I don't know the word I am looking for, cheap? or is it ok so long as is it is only once.

I have a quest that the party will be running in a few weeks and I thought I would change the ending to make it unexpected (even though I will leave evidence so my player COULD catch on and prevent it) but I was wondering if there is any pitfalls to this, except that the players will find a way to FUBAR it and claim the artefact, which would be ok

 

[MarkB]

It's a fairly common trope in fiction, either through the bad guy letting the protagonist do all the work and then ambushing them, or their emplyer turning out to have been the bad guy all along.

But I'd tend to use it sparingly in games - the players identify more with their characters, and have put a great deal more time into achieving their goals than the average reader or viewer. That can make such setbacks feel a lot more personal.

Probably the best way to handle this is to use such a plot device as a sort of prologue - make the quest to find the item a relatively short one, then after it's taken, the hunt to retrieve it becomes the real quest.

An alternative is to ensure that there is still some significant plot-related reward that the PCs can walk away with at the end of the quest in lieu of the main prize - something that will make them feel like the quest resulted in some forward progress, rather than just a big step backwards.

 

[Omegaxicor]

the idea is that the quest is to recover the artefact and then there are several quests to locate the thief and then to acquire the artefact again later in the campaign, it is a side-quest but I am thinking that so long as the players show some progress towards finding it then their employer is willing to fund their exploits in that endeavour and allow them to complete the main objective of the campaign... Win/Win really but it might not seem that way at first :/

 

[Rune]

Can you do it in a way that doesn't feel heavy-handed? If you can, you could potentially get your players to really hate whatever villain does this to them.

Most likely, though, you'll probably just piss your players off, because of what feels like a very cheap railroad. Because, if you can't find a way to do it that doesn't feel heavy-handed, it is a very cheap railroad.

If I were going to try something like this, I would let it develop for a lot longer than over the course of one level. I would also try to give the PCs plenty of rope to hang themselves in this respect. I would give them plenty of clues that someone was after them and/or the artifact, but I would also give them plenty of time and opportunity to let their guard down. You know, so they only have themselves and the villain to blame.

Then, I'd make sure that the villain struck them when they were weakest and taunted the party while he was at it. Mercilessly.

 

[Rune]

I guess the boards really liked my post--they put it up twice!

 

[Omegaxicor]

any examples of how not to do it "heavy-handed" because I can't think of any way to do it that isn't...

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

There's no way to do it without being heavy-handed. An EL-appropriate encounter will probably fail to steal the artifact, and the PCs will get paranoid about not leaving it unattended. You're probably better off just trying to steal it, and acknowledging the thieves will probably fail.

 

[Dragoslav]

Go for it. As a player I wouldn't feel cheated by it, especially since they're only level 1. It sounds like a good way to make a hook for further questing.

 

[Ahnehnois]

One simple solution is to simply let them have the artifact for a while and then have someone take it away. Another would be to add some in-game pressure for them to dispose of it, destroy it, or give it away. It feels less like deus ex machina if you give the players a legitimate chance to use it, even if you don't plan on letting them hold onto it forever.

 

[Omegaxicor]

@Ahnehnois The artefact plays a central role in the campaign later and is waaaaaay too powerful for a first level character, not mention the infighting as the players try to decide which of them gets to use it...

@(Psi)SeveredHead stealing the artefact isn't the issue, I have that all drawn up, the issue is how to make it seem less defeating. I think the fact it is the start of a long quest chain to recover it lessens the blow as does laying clues so they have a chance to see it coming, although I am pretty sure the players won't pick up on them.