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ENWorld Spamletter

Arnwyn

First Post
We're sorry you find it disturbing. Since you had registered at the site, it seemed reasonable to guess that things going on at the site would be of interest to you.
That's why you use the "opt-in" methodology, not the weasely "opt-out". And no, registering for ENWorld forums is not an "opt-in" for newsletter emails.

(As an aside - another hotmail account user here, and I also did not receive it. Maybe I got lucky and managed to turn it off long before receiving the spam (i.e. unsolicited email).)
 

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CapnZapp

Legend
If you look at the bottom of the newsletter there is an option to unsubscribe.
But that requires opening the newsletter, which requires un-deleting it.

How do I access the unsubscribe switch without accessing the newsletter itself?

Requiring one to opening up an email reminds me of real spammers, who would use this to detect an active email account. Not to speak about having to click a link in an unsolicited email...

It's real, I chatted with Russ about it on Facebook.
Of course you realize we can't all be chatting with Russ, and indeed some of us aren't on Facebook at all.

How about ENWorld heralding their newsletter on the main page as well as a forum announcement weeks in advance, to let people know their "spam letter" actually is real?!

One thing I did learn is that the "no newsletter" setting deep in the Options in your user account is referring to an older attempt at a newsletter and doesn't affect whether you get this one or not; so you should use the unsubscribe link on the newsletter itself.
Thanks for letting me know any attempts at scouring my options would be a waste of time.

We're sorry you find it disturbing. Since you had registered at the site, it seemed reasonable to guess that things going on at the site would be of interest to you. There's an unsubscribe option in the newsletter, and will be one in all following newsletters.
Sorry, but that's not nearly good enough.

I request an options setting, so that I don't have to even open the newsletter once to get rid of it! Of course, common courtesy would indicate you turning it off for me.

Or in other words:
That's why you use the "opt-in" methodology, not the weasely "opt-out". And no, registering for ENWorld forums is not an "opt-in" for newsletter emails.
 

wedgeski

Adventurer
Requiring one to opening up an email reminds me of real spammers, who would use this to detect an active email account. Not to speak about having to click a link in an unsolicited email...
Although I agree in principle that you should have been able to opt-out before-hand, I think you're being overly harsh here.

Spam is a nightmare. I know. I have a hard enough time dealing with it myself. But this isn't some random farmed mass-mailer, this is a site to which you have already provided your email address and which (presumably) creates content you enjoy. One email in your Inbox, three seconds to find the link, 2 seconds to check it goes where it says it goes, and a few seconds to click it are not going to ruin your day, are they? :)
 

Elephant

First Post
If you look at the bottom of the newsletter there is an option to unsubscribe.

Other than that, as far as I can see it's entirely real and simply repeats a list of the most recent news stories and some of the more popular forum threads.

I hardly think that one newsletter is enough to decry Morrus for "spamming" you - if he'd sent four or five in the same day, maybe.

Oh, well, since there's an 'unsubscribe' link, it's okay.

Not.

The point is, I should never have received the email in the first place -- if I wanted a newsletter subscription, I would have signed up for it from the ENWorld homepage.

As for labeling it "spam", it's an unwanted automated mass email. The fact that it's not hawking Viagra or diet pills is irrelevant.

I got two copies (probably for my two accounts), which did land in my spam folder. However, I also received a different email back on March 24th, which did announce that the newsletter would come:

I never got an announcement email. Either way, it wouldn't have mattered -- the announcement email didn't include an opt-out option, did it?

They were going out in stages, but I thought they had all gone out by now. Otherwise, what Eric said - it's legit, and if you don't want to receive it hit the unsubscribe link...

If I took the time to hunt for and click the unsubscribe link in every unwanted email that finds its way to my inbox, I'd never get anything else done!

Just because this particular newsletter email is not a major inconvenience doesn't excuse Morrus for inconveniencing me in the first place.

That's why you use the "opt-in" methodology, not the weasely "opt-out". And no, registering for ENWorld forums is not an "opt-in" for newsletter emails.

Well-put. A newsletter can be a good thing...so long as you actually send it to the people who want it...and only the people who want it.

Although I agree in principle that you should have been able to opt-out before-hand, I think you're being overly harsh here.

Spam is a nightmare. I know. I have a hard enough time dealing with it myself. But this isn't some random farmed mass-mailer, this is a site to which you have already provided your email address and which (presumably) creates content you enjoy. One email in your Inbox, three seconds to find the link, 2 seconds to check it goes where it says it goes, and a few seconds to click it are not going to ruin your day, are they? :)

First - in principle, I should never have had to opt out. I should have been given an opportunity to opt-in (which, in my case, I would have forgone).
Second - you're underestimating the time it takes to deal with the newsletter. It's more like five seconds to start reading before going "What IS this ... stuff? I didn't sign up for a blinking newsletter!" Another five seconds to weigh searching the email vs. clicking "report spam", followed by 5-10 to search the email for an unsubscribe link (I'm a fast reader. Low-literacy readers would have to read the entire email in order to find the unsubscribe link. Count it as 2-3 minutes for them.), and finally another 5 seconds for checking the link and clicking.

Plus the bad feelings about it that led me to post here and spend over ten minutes engaged in this thread, of course.

As I said earlier, just because it's a "minor" inconvenience doesn't grant license to incur the inconvenience in the first place.
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
Well, well.

To those of you who are upset by the newsletter - I'm sorry. It was sent with the best of intentions, in the belief you'd be interested in it, and goes out only to those who have indicated that they will accept emails from the admin on their account page.

I've tried to make it as easy as possible. First, you can elect not to receive emails from me in your account; second, there's an unsubscribe link in the email itself; third, at the top of the front page, there's a "Newsletter" link which you can use to review past newsletters, unsubscribe, or what-have-you.

It's a mixed bag - I've had a lot of folks say they really like it, so I'm glad for that. The aim was to do something useful, not to bug you.
 

Knight Otu

First Post
Either way, it wouldn't have mattered -- the announcement email didn't include an opt-out option, did it?

Technically it did, except the email didn't say which of the options to uncheck. I wouldn't have thought of unchecking "Emails from Admins" for this from the announcement mail itself, and even so, unchecking that option does sound like a somewhat bad idea ("Well, we might have been able to sort out things regarding your ban if you had allowed to be emailed, but this way...").
 

The definition of e-mail Spam is typically that it be "unsolicited" and "bulk".

As a point worth mentioning - communicating with your clients, subscribers and registered user base, even through bulk email, is looked upon as normal mail according to the most definitions of spam such as the one provided by the Spamhaus Project. Further there is no way this would qualify under the CAN-SPAM definition of spam.

Being a registered member of a website and getting the newsletter of news relevant to that website from that website is a serious stretch of any definition of spam.
 

La Bete

First Post
It's a mixed bag - I've had a lot of folks say they really like it, so I'm glad for that. The aim was to do something useful, not to bug you.

Hi Morrus,

I can't say that I'm jumping with joy over the email, but am blissfully unconcerned about you sending it, and appreciated you taking the time to come up with new ways to make the site more useful to us. Keep up the good work!

Elephant/CapnZapp - overreacting posters are overreacting.

Pleeease tell me you post on CM.
 

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