Epic Destinies and Earth Giants

[Thornir Alekeg]

Grab a random kobold and toss him in first so that he dies and strips the wards away?

No, because we know the wards protecting Al'grazzar feed on evil. Tossing in a kobold would only strengthen the wards. To bring them down one must be strong enough in body, spirit and heart to willingly withstand the wards for several minutes in order to make them expend all their energy.

Thinking about the Archmage powers again, one thing they don't mention, and I don't think we've seen, is if there are new, more powerful encounter and daily spells in the Epic tier. Perhaps the bending the laws of the universe will be more evident in the spells than in the abilities.

 

[Cadfan]

I have to jump in here to support the Archmage's powers.

Spell Recall is about equivalent to an extra spell slot of your best spell level in 3e. It may not be flashy, but its anything but trivial. It seems appropriate for level 21.

Arcane Spirit is flashy, everyone seems to agree on that. Should be a fun villain power, too. "His soul is escaping! Get it!"

Shape Magic is quite literally equivalent to getting an extra spell slot of the level of your best spell, except better because you can choose on the fly what to do with it. Again, not flashy, but anything but trivial.

So, at level 26 in the epic destiny, you've got two more daily powers spells than anyone else.

And at level 30, when you get Archspell, you get a daily spell as a per encounter. Again, not flashy, but quite powerful. You no longer need to hold back big guns in case you need them later. Meteor Swarm can become your combat opener.

So... fine, they're not flashy. But for a "generic archmage" epic destiny, it 1) has a lot of power to it, and 2) is highly customizable. And that seems to be what it should be.

 

[AllisterH]

Mythological roots? You mean back to Norse and Greek mythology? Oh wait, that's all gone now with the destruction of the Great Wheel. Or perhaps something like the story of "Jack the Giant Killer"? Hmn, wait, I don't think Jack was forced to deal with elemental beings. No, whatever these things are, they aren't going back to any recognizable mythological roots so far as what I can see. They don't even go back to D&D's roots because they jettisoned all that came before.

You got to be kidding me, right? Norse and Greek mythology != Great Wheel. A thousand curses on planescape for shoehorning the Greeks et al into the Great Wheel.

As for the epic destinies, I actually like that they didn't go for "bigger numbers". The fact that an archmage can use any daily power every 5 minutes isn't epic enough? Can you imagine the sheer awe on younger mages when they start practising their once daily meteor swarms and the headmaster calmly walks in and starts throwing meteor swarms EVERY 5 MINUTES?

Even a level 20 wizard in 4E should have the jaws on the ground watching him do that...

 

[I'm A Banana]

Are you just in this thread to shoot down other peoples ideas? The only posts i've seen from you are just that. Please try to contribute something constructive instead.

The irony of this being your only post is not lost on me.

thnx 4 teh lulz, mang!

 

[Mirtek]

Are you just in this thread to shoot down other peoples ideas? The only posts i've seen from you are just that. Please try to contribute something constructive instead.

As the idea was described that was the most sensible solution almsot anyone would come to.

 

[Rechan]

Okay! Earth Stomp is now in the statblock:

Close BurstEarth Shock (standard; encounter)
Close burst 2; +18 vs. Fortitude; 2d10 + 6 damage, and the target is stunned until the end of the earth titan’s next turn. Miss: Half damage, and the target is not stunned.

A thought occurs to me: What if Earth giants are the weakest? What if Fire/Storm/etc guys are the weakest of the Giants?

But then I have to wonder why Earth, the strongest, most durable, "Old as the mountains" element is the weakest.

I think in my games, the stats for the Earth Titan will be a regular giant, and the actual Titan will be a Solo.

 

[OchreJelly]

I bet I'm ninja'ed but it's been updated:

Earth Shock (standard; encounter)
Close burst 2; +18 vs. Fortitude; 2d10 + 6 damage, and the target is stunned until the end of the earth titan’s next turn. Miss: Half damage, and the target is not stunned.

 

[Sojorn]

I'm a little bit confused as to what people were expecting with the Epic Destinies.

Most of the flashy stuff is offloaded onto the classes. The EDs are really more of a meta-class than the paragon paths. The class lets you drop big rocks of doom on people (or make pit fiend a slave to your will for a few seconds. Or whatever). The ED lets you drop big rocks of doom every encounter rather than once a day.

Using a daily more than once a day or as an encounter is indeed breaking the rules of the game. It just seems to be a bit more subtle than most were hoping for?

 

[Zil]

When you're 21+ level, you're no longer a farmboy who picked up a sword. You are practically a godling by this point.

And perhaps that is why I've never cared for epic level play in 3E and now it sounds like it might be worse in 4E. It's all too cheesy for my tastes - like Xena dancing on flag poles with Aries. I like the world to stay a dangerous place and high level not meaning comic book superhero. Guess I should be shopping around for a different game if I ever want to play something truly epic.

 

[Burne]

I love the idea of epic destinies, but that one really leaves me cold.

"You build a tower somewhere and never leave it. Good game."

I'm hoping some of the other ones are better - I was hoping for stuff like "How to become a god" - stuff we couldn't do before. It's not like it was particularly tough to do "Your wizard starts a wizarding school" with the rules we had before.

And yet that's exactly what a friend of mine's character did. Moridin made a tower, married a dyrad and founded a college. He was a Blood Magus so I'd file the serial numbers of the Arcane Spirit and make it some sort of blood form, but otherwise the Destiny is a perfect fit. In later campaigns, our character's have visited Moridin's tower, and recently (as we approach epic powers ourself) we're met him directly.

And it's true, you could found a wizard tower in the old rules, in fact if memory serves there were rules for playing a Wizard before 4th edition as well, and as other poster's have pointed out, rules for achieving godhood as well. Arguing that the rules don't add anything new is a good argument for not switching your game to 4th edition, but not a reason to object to a particular rule. I find the rules for rope sort of tedious and repetitive as well, but I won't argue that they don't have a place in 4th ed.

Burne