Epic Levels Without Ridiculous Amounts of Wealth?

[the Jester]

Does anyone have any ideas on how to pull this off?

My biggest beef with the epic rules is that the pcs require more money than most kingdoms. Hell, a large party of 30th level characters will have as much monetary value as most of the rest of the world combined! Moreover, the wealth is tied tightly to epic pcs' ability to use their epic powers, especially any epic item creation and epic spellcasting (and epic spell research) that they want to do.

I don't want to simply drop the cost of stuff in all respects; I like the fact that it takes a lot of time and xps to develop the epic goodness. Short of just lowering the gp cost only does anyone have a system for this?

The best thing I've come up with so far is based on the sorcerers' sand in the Sword of Truth books- basically some kind of substance that substitutes for a big chunk of the gp cost of epic spell/item development. Anybody have anything else?

Thanks!

 

[Vlos]

You could use material substitutions in place of coinage. For example, a dragon's scales or pristine dragon tooth = 1,000gp worth of coin in research or material components for item creation.

There is a post somewhere here which is components of a monster, basically what can be salvaged from a killed monster. All you would need to do is assing GP values to them and then they can be used in those process.

This gets around the high wealth, as the only ones who would be using them items would be those at epic levels.

 

[Nyaricus]

the latter part of this post after "proposal" in that recent discussion on updating eipc stuff might help you Jester

http://www.enworld.org/showpost.php?p=2711103&postcount=18

cheers!

 

[Sravoff]

You could try using an abstract use of owing "favors".

The farmer, will put up the characters for the night, while the king will give the characters his best smith as a personal weaponsmith.

The rewards won't be based as evenly when compared by gold for gold value, but to the farmer, giving up three or four portions of food and a couple of cots is quite alot, for him.

I don't know if this will help at all, but I'll toss it out there any way.

 

[The Edge]

Although Ive never ran or played an epic game, I dont see that money would be as important once you get to the ledgendary status. In a normal society, these people could get just about what ever they need or want (I dont mean stealing). A kingdom would happily suply their heroes with as much potions and free healing as they could possibly need, also free rooms in one of the kings stately home too.

Gods and celestials dont deal with money, so higher powers would require different 'payments'. eg, In exchange for the construction of a wonderous weapon or atifact, a apropriate quest. If someplace is truely in need of help they will help their helpers in anyway they can so may give or lend special items or facillites (spell research etc) as needed.

Money is only a tool for bartering with normal people, and can only achieve what there is to be bought. In my games a epic weapon or such would never be sold, it would be granted to a trusted person best able to use it well. Any epic character would likely have already seen all that money can give, and have shifted over to bigger or deeper goals. A monk may continue to aspire to an ever greater mastery of her self, a paladin to seek out and destroy ever greeter evils, or maybe the fighter wants no more than a cosy home, and will fight when he is needed if he belives in the cause; perhaps starting to wonder what his life means haveing known nothing but combat.

I say money means less than ever for epics in a well made and run campain world.

 

[the Jester]

I say money means less than ever for epics in a well made and run campain world.

The problem is specifically about epic spells and magic items. The cost to research an epic spell or craft an epic item is huge, and that is where pcs need tons and tons of money.

 

[Cheiromancer]

I don't suppose you can handwave it, can you? Allow them to research epic spells or craft epic items, and count it towards their recommended wealth?

I.e. if a character is "supposed" to have 8 million gp, but only has 200 000 gp in equipment and items, then he has a 7.8 million gp credit that he can apply towards these costly things. If a wizard, he spends a few days researching and poof! he has the spell, and 900 000 gp less credit. Or if a fighter, he collaborates with an artificier and after a few weeks has a potent epic item, and 2.1 million gp less credit. And so on.
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[the Jester]

I don't suppose you can handwave it, can you? Allow them to research epic spells or craft epic items, and count it towards their recommended wealth?

I.e. if a character is "supposed" to have 8 million gp, but only has 200 000 gp in equipment and items, then he has a 7.8 million gp credit that he can apply towards these costly things. If a wizard, he spends a few days researching and poof! he has the spell, and 900 000 gp less credit. Or if a fighter, he collaborates with an artificier and after a few weeks has a potent epic item, and 2.1 million gp less credit. And so on.

I could, but that seems unfair to the other pcs- since I really don't anticipate ever giving away enough wealth per level as the ELH suggests (hell, except maybe rolling it up into epic items- but if I reduce the money value of all of the epic items, I'm back to square one).

Edit: I just realized that you had a suggestion in there re: fighters collaborating. I kind of like that idea (though I don't use artificers)- maybe he could provide the xp and such as well. Hmm... that's always a topic I have a deep debate without myself on (someone else expending the xp for item creation), but in this case it seems like a good solution.

Mull, mull.

 

[XeviatTranion]

I don't think any epic character should ever be able to liquidate their assets into a planet sized mountain of coins: there simply isn't that much gold in the world. PC wealth is holed up inside their magic items, and the extraordinarily weathy would most likely barter.

The cost to research epic spells and make epic items need not be coins, but items of similar value. If you go with the suggested "monster parts", you should determine how much can be harvested from a single creature and count that against their treasure. My players hardly deal with coin; the last time they tried to sell a magic sword they were offered several lesser items and services in return. I am careful to monitor my player's wealth, so they generally have the equipment they need.

 

[the Jester]

Hmm, maybe what I need to do is simply introduce extremely valuable loot infrequently, thus giving the party occasional bumps up above their recommended level and then letting it ride for a while...