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Erik Mona's Lo-Fi Experience System
- Thread starter Erik Mona
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greywulf
First Post
Here's the thing; charging XPs for creating magic items is downright wrong anyhow, so you're losing nothing by getting rid of it.
Making magic items is an outside the game thing. It's what your characters (those few that can) do while you're not looking. We don't role-play the creation of that Sword+1 or Ring of Nifty Colors or whatever. They do it while we're away, and what they do while we're not playing them is their own business
They don't get XP if they kill critters while the players aren't around, so why deduct XP for out-of-game stuff too?
If follows that Item Creation feats aren't the right way to go - you're taking up a feat slot for something that's an out-of-game mechanic. That's like having a "Going Shopping" feat, or a "Find Really Cool Vacation Place" feat. You get the idea. You're taking a valuable feat slot up (and charging XP) to penalize the already feat-starved Wizard, just because Making Stuff Is What Wizards Do.
Here's what I do in Microlite20 (and Real D&D too, for that matter):
Clerics and Wizards gain the ability to make magic items at certain class levels. This translates to being able to buy these items, but at half their usual purchase price. This represents the raw materials required to make the item. Making items requires equipment (a forge, etc), the right skills and time as per the existing item creation rules. Making magic items does not cost XP.
Here's when Wizards and Clerics can make stuff:
1 Scroll
3 Potion and Wondrous Item
5 Wand, Arms and Armor
9 Rod
12 Staff, Ring
(Basically the same as the feat prerequisites)
In a way, this is the same as giving Wizards and Clerics those feats for free, but (like Sneak), it's taking them out of the feats list at the same time and making them exclusive abilities of those classes (and losing the XP requirement at the same time). That fills up the sparse Wizard level goodie list, and makes those classes a little more unique too.
Making magic items is an outside the game thing. It's what your characters (those few that can) do while you're not looking. We don't role-play the creation of that Sword+1 or Ring of Nifty Colors or whatever. They do it while we're away, and what they do while we're not playing them is their own business
They don't get XP if they kill critters while the players aren't around, so why deduct XP for out-of-game stuff too?If follows that Item Creation feats aren't the right way to go - you're taking up a feat slot for something that's an out-of-game mechanic. That's like having a "Going Shopping" feat, or a "Find Really Cool Vacation Place" feat. You get the idea. You're taking a valuable feat slot up (and charging XP) to penalize the already feat-starved Wizard, just because Making Stuff Is What Wizards Do.
Here's what I do in Microlite20 (and Real D&D too, for that matter):
Clerics and Wizards gain the ability to make magic items at certain class levels. This translates to being able to buy these items, but at half their usual purchase price. This represents the raw materials required to make the item. Making items requires equipment (a forge, etc), the right skills and time as per the existing item creation rules. Making magic items does not cost XP.
Here's when Wizards and Clerics can make stuff:
1 Scroll
3 Potion and Wondrous Item
5 Wand, Arms and Armor
9 Rod
12 Staff, Ring
(Basically the same as the feat prerequisites)
In a way, this is the same as giving Wizards and Clerics those feats for free, but (like Sneak), it's taking them out of the feats list at the same time and making them exclusive abilities of those classes (and losing the XP requirement at the same time). That fills up the sparse Wizard level goodie list, and makes those classes a little more unique too.
Henry
Autoexreginated
THe only bad side to the system IMO is the "killed PCs don't get XP for the combat" part. Last game session, having fought a very hard fight for about 20 rounds, in which I played a major part, only to be killed on the last round of combat, I would have been sorely ticked off if the DM were using that rule.
GoodKingJayIII
First Post
Lots of people have mentioned ignoring or handwaving the Crafting rules, but what about spells that have an XP cost? Is that also something you ignore, handwave, or house rule on the fly? Maybe you have some kind of reserve pool similar to UA's?
XP isn't just a measure of when a character levels. It's also a resource, like hit points or spell, and is used to fuel cetain abilities and tasks. If you continue into high-level play evntually it's going to come up.
XP isn't just a measure of when a character levels. It's also a resource, like hit points or spell, and is used to fuel cetain abilities and tasks. If you continue into high-level play evntually it's going to come up.
Can we have less of this, "XP is easy with a computer", most of us know this already but not everyone actually has a computer in their gaming room (I usually don't) and it's usually nice to level up at the end of a session rather than the beginning.
For Crafting items, I know a lot of people use Action Dice, has anyone considered using these for creating items?
Of course mileage varies depending on which version of AD you use, Eberrons AD refresh every level but not at other times, which actually ties in quite nicely... because magic items become less usefull as you go up levels. Your Sword +X is usually very nifty when you first make it, but less next level, and even less the level after.
From the AD variants I use I'd either go for 1 AD/1000xp or part of in the Items cost (allow a batch of potions to count as 1 item for this purpose), of deny the character 1 AD per level/session (depending how often the refresh) per 1000gp in the expense.
If your AD don't scale with level already you may want to change that to 1000xp X character level, or some similar number?
Just random thinking, It'd need some hammering out to balance correctly.
For Crafting items, I know a lot of people use Action Dice, has anyone considered using these for creating items?
Of course mileage varies depending on which version of AD you use, Eberrons AD refresh every level but not at other times, which actually ties in quite nicely... because magic items become less usefull as you go up levels. Your Sword +X is usually very nifty when you first make it, but less next level, and even less the level after.
From the AD variants I use I'd either go for 1 AD/1000xp or part of in the Items cost (allow a batch of potions to count as 1 item for this purpose), of deny the character 1 AD per level/session (depending how often the refresh) per 1000gp in the expense.
If your AD don't scale with level already you may want to change that to 1000xp X character level, or some similar number?
Just random thinking, It'd need some hammering out to balance correctly.
Crothian said:
We went a step further. Our DM, (whose Excel-fu is strong) wrote a spreadsheet. On each row you enter x creatures of CR y. Scroll down a few rows and and enter character levels a, b & c. It then lists total XP for the session by character level.
Took him a little while to get it working; but it's quite handy.
Pbartender
First Post
greywulf said:
That's a great idea.
Another idea, that I haven't had opportunity to try yet is:
Turn the craft feats into subsets of the Craft skill.
Craft (potion), Craft (Scroll), Craft (Wand), Craft (magic armor), and such...
They'd be class skills for major spellcasting classes (Bard, Cleric, Druid, Sorcerer, Wizard, etc...) and cross-class for everyone else. That's means a dwarven fighter could feasibly craft his own magical axe, but... he'd still need a means to gain access to the appropriate spells required to craft the item, if necessary.
You could also apply synergy bonuses when appropriate... +2 to Craft (potion) from 5 ranks in Craft (alchemy), +2 to Craft (scroll) from 5 ranks in Decipher Script, +2 Craft (magic weapon) from 5 ranks in Craft (Weaponsmithing), and so on.
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