Errors from previous editions which got repeated.

[Derren]

Has anyone found errors in 4E which were already be present in previous editions?

Imo simply adding the cost of creating magic items to the general ritual costs looks a lot like 3Es fabricate where the base material was included as component cost and thus you were able to fabricate everything for free with when you managed to remove component costs.

Likewiese at epic level one can get a huge ritual price reduction, only paying 18,75% of the original price at epic levels, which makes magic item creation very cheap.

Having the cost for the magical item creation separate from the ritual costs would have been better.

(And yes, I know that most DMs will simply rule that magic item creation is not affected by this price reduction).

 

[-Avalon-]

Have not really found any exact copy issues of past errors. In contrast, I have found that it is quite the opposite, literally.

Instead of having players with 12 attacks per round that do 100-200 per attack, and enemies that have almost no HP to stand against it.... We now have players with ONE attack per round usually, and they do about 20-50 per attack average... against enemies with dump trucks full of HP behind them.

End Result: Fights in 3rd became insane due to needing to throw enemies against players in such numbers or power that players were either grinding or dying. Now, it is insane because the game is set up to throw tons of minions and a few real enemies against players (which becomes a grind), or throw a larger number of bigger badder BBEG's (which can quickly lead to TPKs), or throw one REALLY BBEG against them, and it becomes a grindfest because the fight quickly dissolves into "I swing, hit, do 20, next" type rounds...

The pendulum was swung so far to the left in 3rd, that when they "fixed" the game, it swung to the opposite side in 4th. I am glad that they are starting to realize this, and the new classes do more damage per round, I think, than the ones in the original PHB. But that does little to fix the original classes, and in the end, I think we will see more people playing druids and invokers than wizards, warden instead of paladin, bard over warlord... Fighter is still good, cleric is still good, rogue is still good... but, every class in PHB2 seems well-built and all...

Some classes (mainly paladin) were underpowered in the orignal 3 books, and have yet to really see any loving. Wizard was a bit off, they gave them a section in one of the first dragon mags that fixed that. Hardly a month had gone by after swordmage (arguably an overpowered class) got some love (like they needed it)... Paladins have nothing new, and continue to be badly underpowered.

The only thing I guess I could say is the repeated error? Not fixing the older stuff, and instead coming out with new stuff to gloss over the issue. (IE weapon expertise to fix the gap in TH's and Defenses, or make new better classes so no one cares about the bad old ones, etc)

 

[Keenath]

It's small and unimportant, but I'm still frustrated that they've continued the "Falchion is a great-scimitar" thing. A falchion is a french weapon that is SPECIFICALLY one-handed, and sits somewhere between an axe and a sword in terms of use -- it's effectively a war-machete.

Where they got the idea that this would be a good name for a massive curve-bladed sword, I will never know.

 

[Alex319]

Likewiese at epic level one can get a huge ritual price reduction, only paying 18,75% of the original price at epic levels, which makes magic item creation very cheap.

Where do you get such a massive price reduction? I assume there's some kind of feats involved, but I can't seem to find them.

 

[Derren]

Where do you get such a massive price reduction? I assume there's some kind of feats involved, but I can't seem to find them.

Only doable at epic level.

- Cast at a Fey Line crossing (Manual of the Planes) -25%
- Use Ritualist Ring -50% (I hope that is correct)
- Loremaster ED Ability -50%

1*0.75*0.5*0.5 = 0.1875

See Why pay full price for magic items at higher level - Wizards Community

 

[phil500]

the fighter is gimped.

 

[-Avalon-]

the fighter is gimped.

How so? Play a tempest or battle rager... the BRV in our group doesn't seem to be able to be killed... has a paladin's AC, outdamages a paladin greatly (but not nearly a striker), and takes a lot less damage than the other defenders we have played around with... Fighters seem to be just where they ought to be.

 

[Pale Jackal]

How so? Play a tempest or battle rager...

Aren't those both from Martial Power? While I don't begrudge Wizards selling their splat books (and I own the PHB2, and will probably pick up the MM2), if the core fighter options are genuinely underpowered, then I think they should be errata'd. That's what good game companies do: they fix things that are imbalanced, and they do it for free. Obviously, Wizards needs to make money, but if what people say about the PHB2 is true (that Wizards is doing its job better now and has learned how to design classes better), I think doing some retro-fitting to prior classes isn't unreasonable.

 

[robsenworldaccount]

These "grind" references intrigue me.
I feel that they reflect more on the DM's monster composition, rather than the system itself.

In effect, if you throw an incorrect composition it can certainly be a "grinding" experience. This is especially so if you have a matrix ill designed to deal with said comp.

 

[Eldorian]

the fighter is gimped.

The core fighter is a fine class, and the MP fighters are borderline too good.