Essentials and Treasure Parcels Analyzed

[occam]

@occam Hmmm, you're the first person I've ever heard suggest that there is any relationship between a sandbox and random treasure (or random anything really). Honestly I've run what I would consider heavily sandboxed games for 30 years and have ALMOST never used random treasures or random encounters. Certainly you CAN, but the two aren't particularly related.

I have no problem with people using whatever treasure system they like, of course. It would be nice if this not-a-new-version had both options.

I don't particularly like pre-placing treasures throughout a wide area with lots of encounter possibilities, most of which the players may never see. (I used to, when I was younger and had more time.)

Here's the nice thing about this system: While the parcel system balances treasure allocation over an entire level consisting of 10 or so encounters, the random system balances allocation per treasure, meaning you don't have to spend as much time planning out treasure an entire level at a time. You can trust to statistical averages to handle roughly appropriate allocation for you. This is a good feature for a group that frequently changes party composition.

I'm not saying this should replace the parcel system, but it's a useful option for certain cases.

And as I mentioned earlier, I also like the callback to 1e treasure types with the random rolls.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

I don't particularly like pre-placing treasures throughout a wide area with lots of encounter possibilities, most of which the players may never see. (I used to, when I was younger and had more time.)

Here's the nice thing about this system: While the parcel system balances treasure allocation over an entire level consisting of 10 or so encounters, the random system balances allocation per treasure, meaning you don't have to spend as much time planning out treasure an entire level at a time. You can trust to statistical averages to handle roughly appropriate allocation for you. This is a good feature for a group that frequently changes party composition.

I'm not saying this should replace the parcel system, but it's a useful option for certain cases.

And as I mentioned earlier, I also like the callback to 1e treasure types with the random rolls.

Mmmm, I don't think it is balanced per treasure at all. You roll some dice and blame the imbalance on luck is all. Now, I can see a few use cases for random treasure, but you STILL have to pick the items and that is still the bulk of the treasure value, so it is actually not all THAT random.

Personally I prefer to just create 10 parcels and place them strategically. Either the players can learn where the more important ones are (the items) or they can be placed in ways that assure that they become available. Even in a pure sandbox this is not really an issue. Fundamentally I don't think random treasure does much for you. It just means the DM can say "hey, the dice did it."

 

[Bercilak]

The new Essentials treasure method just "feels" more like D&D to me--probably because I've been playing quite a while, so random treasure has always been a part of the game for me.. (And I would never suggest my feelings are more valid than someone else's.)

However, I'm not sure the Essentials rules work all that well mathematically. My group only has 4 players (and a DM), so we subtract 2 from each roll we make on the treasure table. (If we only had 3 players, we'd subtract 4.) In a few random rolls, I wound up getting far fewer items than the original treasure parcel system.

With only four players, for example, I'd have to roll 15+ to get a magic item. (If Small Roller is right) there's only a 62% chance of me rolling three magic items in ten rolls. Compared to the 100% chance from the treasure parcel system, that's a significant decrease. Over 20 levels, my players would get 60 magic items under the old system, but only (on average) 37, under the new system. (And with more limited abilities to make their own items.) (And the chance of rolling at least one maximum level item in those three items would be about 58%, which is also far less than the 100% chance under the old system.

(Of course, I'd also have a 1% chance of rolling 7 magic items... I guess we could debate the value of examining our loss aversion here.)

I think the randomness of rolls will make treasure average out more closely between the two systems, but I'm not sure about the magic item balance in the long haul.

-Berc

 

[buddhafrog]

I don't understand why I, the DM, would roll random treasure in preparation. I just assign appropriate treasure where I see fit. However, I love to have players roll this random treasure in-game. This is fun.