Excerpt: You and Your Magic Items

[Mathew_Freeman]

I like the article, and I really like the description of the weapons - simple to understand and tied in to other examples we've seen.

As regards the Identifying issue, surely the DM only has to keep saying "no" if the players keep challenging all the rules? Who are these players that see a game, with rules, and just whine and complain about everything instead of just getting on and playing?

As far as I can see, MAKING players make Arcana checks to identify everything would be more aggravating. We'd end up back with "Sigh, I hand all the loot to the Wizard, and go have a few beers whilst he does all the identifying..."

It's going to be much fun for the Wizard player, it bogs down the game and it's not an interesting use of time for anyone. If characters can just work out what most stuff does (and the article does say MOST items, not ALL) then that's simple and effective and works for most people, surely?

 

[Voss]

Yeah, ok. I can live with it. When I DM, I'm taking items off the market and avoiding the merchant alliance silliness, but I can live with find 'em or make them yourself.
Someone selling an item of power would be a rare and special thing.

I can live with everyone IDing items (they are adventurers after all, its what they do), and everyone has a default skill of Knowing About the Shinies (which has no other use), though I could see restricting it to level + 5, and only things they're proficient in (or wonders).

I just need another name for handwavium. Also trying to decide whether I will stick the +1/5 levels into the character level progression... and what level to give it to the players. 5th is definitely too late- the players would have found 16 items by then, and would have started getting +2 items. Maybe just start it at 1st. The extra +1s will help, but not over-power too the point that it really matters. So, 1,5,10,15,20,25. And then items are just neat, but not a crutch.

 

[ZappoHisbane]

As far as I can see, MAKING players make Arcana checks to identify everything would be more aggravating. We'd end up back with "Sigh, I hand all the loot to the Wizard, and go have a few beers whilst he does all the identifying..."

It's going to be much fun for the Wizard player, it bogs down the game and it's not an interesting use of time for anyone. If characters can just work out what most stuff does (and the article does say MOST items, not ALL) then that's simple and effective and works for most people, surely?

Actually, I don't think I'd be having much fun as the wizard in that case either. "I roll a 14, did I get that one? Cool. Crap, only an 8. Ok, don't know that. 15? No? But the 14 worked? *sigh*" And then the wizard catches flak because we STILL don't know what some of the stuff does.

 

[Heselbine]

Identify was just so annoying. And all that stuff about not knowing what magic items did. Just silly nonsense which got in the way of the fun.

The best thing about 4e (along with all the other best things about 4e) is the removal of silly pointless boredom-inducing badly thought-through 1st edition hangover rules.

 

[Jedi_Solo]

I liked what I saw here.

There is no way I would want to have a three tier setup for the rules. Then you need to have all three tiers listed for (practically) everything in the game.

HP: Always Max, Average, Roll It
Magic: High, Medium, Low
Item Use: All At Will, Average, All 1/day
Item Id: 5 Minutes, 100gp + 1 hour, 100gp + 8 hours

Then, the house rules document would have to have a listing of what was used for everything. Sure, it would be easy for DMs to say "All Moderate" or "All Hard" but you know that isn't how it would turn out in practice.

There is no way I could remember the we would be using the Max HP but the long ID times and the Moderate This and the Easy That and the Hard Other Thing. I'd need them all written down and would greatly extend the House Rules sheet for our group. It is much easier to say All As Written except for X, Y and Z.

And I'm a player in our group - not the DM. I have no problem with House Rules and being told "No" at the start of a campaign.

 

[keterys]

Don't forget this line

Enhancement: Attack rolls and damage rolls

Magic weapons also add their plus to hit and damage (and it seems pretty likely that arcane and divine implements will do likewise. If the pregen DDXP wizard has a +2 wand he will probably get and extra +2 hit with his magic missiles and they will do 2d4+6 instead of 2d6+4)

Cheers

Yeah, I did mean that as well - I had just been talking about their 'special abilities' and someone asked if the d6 was added to all damage so I wanted to be clear.

 

[Wormwood]

The best thing about 4e (along with all the other best things about 4e) is the removal of silly pointless boredom-inducing badly thought-through 1st edition hangover rules.

I prefer to think of them as barnacles encrusting the hull of my game, but '1st edition hangover rules' works too!

 

[Andor]

I assume we're back to Wands of Fire and Wands of Frost now, but if those magical implements add damage to fire or ice spells respectively I'm curious what the bonus is.

They allow you to change Bigby's Forceful Wedgie into Bigby's Flaming Wedgie, a much more feared spell.

 

[Lizard]

Seems to me that identifying magic items could be a great skill challenge.

Failure means thinking the item is non-magical, or activating it in a damaging way, or just wasting charges (so that it can't be used until the next day).

Obvious skills include Arcana, History ("I recognize this blade! It was used in the battle of Squatront!"), Religion ("This symbol is the icon of the god of magic!"), and possibly Nature.

 

[Lizard]

Identify was just so annoying. And all that stuff about not knowing what magic items did. Just silly nonsense which got in the way of the fun.

The best thing about 4e (along with all the other best things about 4e) is the removal of silly pointless boredom-inducing badly thought-through 1st edition hangover rules.

See, I always thought it added to sense of wonder and immersion, that magic items didn't come with instruction manuals.

"Welcome to happy joyous sword of much reaving! For avoiding all double badness, blade not to be touched with digits!"