Exotic zombies at WotC

[Henry]

We're prepping a v.3.0 right now and there will be an update version for those who already have 2.0.

*Henry squeals like a girl*

 

[Tortoise]

I like that gravehound's deathclasp ability, the one where they bite and don't let go until you break them off. That's a neat ability

I agree about how nifty that ability can be when used to evoke fear in players.

Imagine the PC's retreating in the face of some powerful enemies and a couple of big brutes drop the chains to unleash the hounds on the escaping party. A deathclasp or two later and the tension rises even more.

 

[Klaus]

I have 2.0 on CD-Rom will the update work for me as well?

(Put me down as someone who also loves the counter collection digital... Easy to use, easy to resize monsters when needed, as many as I need... My only real problem with it is I want more. And you're solving that. PURE AWESOME in digital format.)

You can buy a CD of the update, just like you could for v.2.0 if you had the original CCDigital. If you reeeally want everything in one CD, you can then burn them together in a single disk. Me, I keep everything in my hard drive.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

The problem I found with the 3.5 templates is that adding them willy-nilly to monsters can create unreasonable challenges. A half (red)-dragon troll is far more of a challenge than a half (blue)-dragon troll, because of the fire immunity. But if you slavishly follow the CR calculation it makes no difference.

I think that's reflective of the general problems the CR tool has. I think it was a noble effort -- and I'm sad to see it seemingly abandoned in 4E -- but it always required a lot more hands-on attention than the RAW suggested.

 

[Celebrim]

These seem like they'll be great to convert from pen and paper to a computer format.

Does Mearls now think that Diablo does D&D better than D&D does? I'm getting more and more of a Diablo II vibe from this the more previews that we see.

UPDATE: I suppose that I should put the obligatory statement in here that I don't necessarily consider that a bad thing. For a lot of people, it's probably a good thing. I'm just curious about the design philosophy.

 

[Scribble]

The problem I found with the 3.5 templates is that adding them willy-nilly to monsters can create unreasonable challenges. A half (red)-dragon troll is far more of a challenge than a half (blue)-dragon troll, because of the fire immunity. But if you slavishly follow the CR calculation it makes no difference.

I'm also guessing templates will work similar to how racial levels or alternate class features work now.

Swaps some powers for others, and you have the new "templated" creature. Unlike in 3e when you change a "type" it won't make a drastic math change throughout the critter. It'll just add or subtract effects.

 

[Zaruthustran]

Was never a fan of templates; way too much fussing around, too much math. The bit from the last zombie article (stating that a gnoll zombie and an orc zombie are the same monster) suggests that 4E is designed to be adjustable on the fly. They're designing in such a way to make it easy for DMs to "wing it".

That's a good thing. Rather than spend 30 minutes accurately adjusting abilities and re-calculating modifiers for your orc (zombie template), you can just yank out the regular zombie stats, maybe add an extra point of damage (for the base orc's strength) and AC (the orc zombie is still wearing armor) and away you go.

I really get the impression that's the way they're doing customization: instead of creating a specific template that gives +4 to Str and forcing you to do the math to derive damage, to hit, skills, and so on, I suspect they'll just say "to make something fill the Big Brute role, add +2 to all of its attacks and damage. Then add 1 to [4e's equivalent to CR]." It's a subtle distinction, but better for DM's because you can explain that +2 to attacks and damage as coming from bigger muscles, better training, precision targeting, or whatever you want.

In other words, sounds like they're focused on the result (tougher monster), rather than bothering with the process (adding to Str, which results in a tougher monster). Hooray!

 

[Klaus]

Count me as a BIG fan of templates. I love that toolbox approach.

Movie LotR's style Balrog? Half-Fiend Huge Fire Elemental ("Shadow and Flame") with whip and longsword.

Jekyll/Hyde style character? Lycanthrope using Ape as the base creature, sans cursed bite.

Dragon that can be ridden by a PC paladin at mid levels? Half-Dragon Heavy Warhorse.

 

[The Little Raven]

Jekyll/Hyde style character? Lycanthrope using Ape as the base creature, sans cursed bite.

This can be even simpler, as I used something like this in a game. He went from human to orc, and that was it.

Dragon that can be ridden by a PC paladin at mid levels? Half-Dragon Heavy Warhorse.

I have horrid visions of Black Beauty caught in some kind of... provocative embrace with Smaug.

 

[Fishbone]

The thing with the gravehound was that instead of biting and sticking on it used to stun with a bite. Since it had good charisma and was undead it was pretty easy to jack that DC up and eliminate someone with a weak Will save.
The stench doesn't seem like a full nauseate effect, more like a Super-Sicken.
The Chillborn doesn't have a full on gimptastic paralyze with a kicker, either.
So it seems that not only are save-or-dies going to be eliminated but so will the save-or-be-screwed-for-1d4-rounds things are going out, too.
It remains to be seen if that is good or bad.