D&D 5E [+]Exploration Falls Short For Many Groups, Let’s Talk About It

[Hussar]

If it’s a simple task that the rogue (shorthand) is doing, it’s just a single check no need for any of this.

If it’s a more complex task, it’s going to take multiple checks, and the task will have multiple components. We just run it clockwise starting with the rogue, anyone can help someone or just pass with a quick “I check all my important gear and wait” or whatever, and if people are doing other stuff they get to do it on their turn.

I’m not sure what you even mean by the question, though. They’re doing whatever it is that they need to do that is making this scene relevant to the current discussion.

But the current scene is the scout scouting. Or the trap guy untrapping.

In other words nothing that @Irlo talked about was even remotely related to what the exploring character was doing so how is it relevant?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

But the current scene is the scout scouting. Or the trap guy untrapping.

No, the current scene is more than that, because other PCs aren’t just standing around contemplating the ecology of dungeons. Just like combat is very very rarely just one character’s scene. Each characters gets moments within the scene.

In other words nothing that @Irlo talked about was even remotely related to what the exploring character was doing so how is it relevant?

Because the scout scouting doesn’t need to be all that is happening while the other PCs sit in hammer space pretending that time isn’t passing.

 

[Hussar]

No, the current scene is more than that, because other PCs aren’t just standing around contemplating the ecology of dungeons. Just like combat is very very rarely just one character’s scene. Each characters gets moments within the scene.

Because the scout scouting doesn’t need to be all that is happening while the other PCs sit in hammer space pretending that time isn’t passing.

I have pretty much zero sympathy for a player who figures that his character can't wait for ten minutes while another character does their thing.
And, let's not forget, the in game time is largely irrelevant. It passes as quickly or as slowly as the DM wishes. If I want an hour to pass, I can simply say, "one hour passes". Poof, time advances. I'm more talking about real table time. It takes time to go around the table, ask for actions from all the players, adjudicated those actions, potentially resolve those actions depending on what they are doing, then come back to that one character who's been sitting in limbo for no real reason.

Again, I'm talking about incentives. What incentive is there for a player to choose to focus on exploration if every time he or she does the exploration thing, the camera immediately shifts off of the character and pans around the table? It takes FAR longer to adjudicate a single round of actions in combat than it does to adjudicate disarming a trap, yet no one would interrupt combat rounds to start talking to an NPC or talk about anything other than combat. Even a player who isn't involved in a particular combat is expected to wait until combat is resolved before doing anything.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

I have pretty much zero sympathy for a player who figures that his character can't wait for ten minutes while another character does their thing.
And, let's not forget, the in game time is largely irrelevant. It passes as quickly or as slowly as the DM wishes. If I want an hour to pass, I can simply say, "one hour passes". Poof, time advances. I'm more talking about real table time. It takes time to go around the table, ask for actions from all the players, adjudicated those actions, potentially resolve those actions depending on what they are doing, then come back to that one character who's been sitting in limbo for no real reason.

Again, I'm talking about incentives. What incentive is there for a player to choose to focus on exploration if every time he or she does the exploration thing, the camera immediately shifts off of the character and pans around the table? It takes FAR longer to adjudicate a single round of actions in combat than it does to adjudicate disarming a trap, yet no one would interrupt combat rounds to start talking to an NPC or talk about anything other than combat. Even a player who isn't involved in a particular combat is expected to wait until combat is resolved before doing anything.

At our table, we typically handle exploration in 10 minute "turns". Each player gets to describe what their character is doing in the scene. This allows for the party to act as a cohesive unit... kinda what I was getting at here in a post upthread:

Very much this.

At our table, during exploration, I ask each player what they are doing in the scene before resolving anything. That enables each player to be involved to the extent they want. Maybe that's keeping watch, maybe that's Working Together / Helping, maybe that's casting Guidance or offering Bardic Inspiration or some other buff on the rogue who is attempting to disarm the trap, or maybe that's doing something else that is important to that PC. If any of these actions warrant an Ability Check, I call for them only after everyone has chimed in.

As it is a collaborative game, that's how we typically treat exploration. The players are not being impatient and no one is getting bent out of shape b/c everyone else gets to say what their PC is doing. Are there times when it makes more sense to just resolve the current action immediately for one character? Sure. But, most of the time, when it comes to exploration, I want to establish what everyone is doing in the scene before I adjudicate so we're all on the same page as to what is happening in the fiction. It doesn't take a long time IRL. It doesn't disincentivize players from investing in exploration skills. It isn't that the characters are impatient, either. Your objections are really alien to me, but I appreciate you expressing them so I can review how we do things. My conclusion: we're doing exploration in a way that works really well for our table.

Clearly YMMV. I get what you are saying. It doesn't work that way for your table. And that's fine.

 

[Maxperson]

And this is one reason why exploring falls short. You would never “pan around” the room in combat. Everyone gets their time to shine.

Combat rounds happen over 6 seconds, so there isn't time to pan around, although it can be argued that everyone getting a turn every round is panning around the room to all the PCs. Disarming a trap is almost always going to take significantly longer.

 

[Maxperson]

No it isn't. You never pan around the room while someone is taking their turn in combat. It's the only time when a player can be absolutely guaranteed to have the spotlight to themselves while they announce, perform and complete their action.

Unless there is a readied action or one of the many other reactions. Then you take the spotlight off of that player, move it to someone else and then move it back.

 

[Maxperson]

Again, I'm talking about incentives. What incentive is there for a player to choose to focus on exploration if every time he or she does the exploration thing, the camera immediately shifts off of the character and pans around the table? It takes FAR longer to adjudicate a single round of actions in combat than it does to adjudicate disarming a trap, yet no one would interrupt combat rounds to start talking to an NPC or talk about anything other than combat. Even a player who isn't involved in a particular combat is expected to wait until combat is resolved before doing anything.

See, I don't do that, either. Combats can last a half hour to an hour in real time depending on what is happening, so if one PC isn't a part of the combat, I will cut away from the combat to that PC to see if he wants to do something. That way the player isn't just sitting there twiddling his thumbs for a good chunk of the night. If the player does have something fairly quick that he wants his PC to do, I'll cut back to him periodically to resolve those actions. If he says he's not doing anything or starts something that will take longer than the combat will in game time, I'll stay with the combat after that first cut away.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I have pretty much zero sympathy for a player who figures that his character can't wait for ten minutes while another character does their thing.

No one is soliciting sympathy, so…okay?

And, let's not forget, the in game time is largely irrelevant. It passes as quickly or as slowly as the DM wishes. If I want an hour to pass, I can simply say, "one hour passes". Poof, time advances. I'm more talking about real table time.

If no real game time is passing, it’s just a quick check and move on, and no one thinks to even declare any other actions.

It takes time to go around the table, ask for actions from all the players, adjudicated those actions, potentially resolve those actions depending on what they are doing, then come back to that one character who's been sitting in limbo for no real reason.

You aren’t in limbo just because other PCs are also doing stuff.

Again, I'm talking about incentives. What incentive is there for a player to choose to focus on exploration if every time he or she does the exploration thing, the camera immediately shifts off of the character and pans around the table?

Well no, the action they’re undertaking starts, and then we cut to the other PCs, and then back to the scout. And it isn’t every time because not every time is going to be an amount of time where anyone cares what the other PCs are doing.

It takes FAR longer to adjudicate a single round of actions in combat than it does to adjudicate disarming a trap, yet no one would interrupt combat rounds to start talking to an NPC or talk about anything other than combat. Even a player who isn't involved in a particular combat is expected to wait until combat is resolved before doing anything.

Um speak only for your own game please. That isn’t true in mine. If there are people not involved, and they aren’t just watching the fight, of course we are cutting to them in between PC and enemy turns.

 

[Hussar]

So which is it? There’s no time to cut away because rounds are six seconds long or are we cutting away and playing out those six second time slices?

Anyway, it’s still Molly a disagreement in styles here which we are not going to resolve.

My point in bringing this up was that I’ve seen your style many times and imo, it results in players who avoid exploration as much as possible. It doesn’t happen at your tables and that’s great. But in me experience it does happen.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

So which is it? There’s no time to cut away because rounds are six seconds long or are we cutting away and playing out those six second time slices?

The contradiction you seem to be reaching for doesn’t exist.

Its both. Which is in play in a given scene depends on the particulars of that scene.

Well, to be fair, this is me interpreting your question because as written it makes no sense AFAICT.

Anyway, it’s still Molly a disagreement in styles here which we are not going to resolve.

My point in bringing this up was that I’ve seen your style many times and imo, it results in players who avoid exploration as much as possible. It doesn’t happen at your tables and that’s great. But in me experience it does happen.

Seeing as you seem to be stuck on a whole different vibe from what anyone else is describing, I kinda doubt that you’ve seen what we are talking about all that often.