Fantasy Concepts: An OGL Fantasy Saga Project

[EditorBFG]

Thanks for the info. . . but I'm just wondering - does that mean PCs can just keep on casting anything they know (or trying to anyway) all day? I'm sure I"m missing something here. . .

Since I conceived this system originally, and worked on it for a while, I'm going to give you a couple missing pieces that will make the Fantasy Concepts magic system work better in play. I ran an FC playtest game at Conquest SF where it became apparent there were problems, but sadly my personal problems caused me to fall away from my work the project before I could transmit that the following changes were necessary:

A) The DC's for spells need to be 10 + twice the spell level.
(Not 15 + spell level. Less elegant, I know, but creates a more desirable success/failure ratio over all 20 levels.)

B) That change made, add the following paragraph at the end of the "Casting a Spell" section at the end of the Casting a Spell section of Fantasy Concepts:

"If you attempt to cast a spell and it fails, at any step in the casting or invoking process, your spell does not activate and your action is considered spent. If you roll a natural one
(1) on the d20 used for your magic power check, or if you fail the roll by 5 or more, in addition you gain a Penalty Level as well."

...and then get rid of the existing final paragraph, It references critical failures, a mechanic not actually defined in Fantasy Concepts.

Note that this is in no way official errata, as I am no longer involved in Fantasy Concepts, but this fixes the problem of spellcasters trying over and over again. Also, it makes 1st level spells easy enough for a 1st level caster to succeed more often than he fails, yet not so easy that a 20th level caster only fails to cast Wish on a natural 1.

 

[Aus_Snow]

Since I conceived this system originally, and worked on it for a while, I'm going to give you a couple missing pieces that will make the Fantasy Concepts magic system work better in play. I ran an FC playtest game at Conquest SF where it became apparent there were problems, but sadly my personal problems caused me to fall away from my work the project before I could transmit that the following changes were necessary:

<snip>

Thank you for taking the time to post that clarification/errata/opinion. It does indeed help me to understand (and appreciate) the system. Well, your version.

The whole FC thing sounds intriguing though. I might just have to check it out anyhow.

 

[Flynn]

Since I conceived this system originally, and worked on it for a while, I'm going to give you a couple missing pieces that will make the Fantasy Concepts magic system work better in play. I ran an FC playtest game at Conquest SF where it became apparent there were problems, but sadly my personal problems caused me to fall away from my work the project before I could transmit that the following changes were necessary:

A) The DC's for spells need to be 10 + twice the spell level.
(Not 15 + spell level. Less elegant, I know, but creates a more desirable success/failure ratio over all 20 levels.)

B) That change made, add the following paragraph at the end of the "Casting a Spell" section at the end of the Casting a Spell section of Fantasy Concepts:

"If you attempt to cast a spell and it fails, at any step in the casting or invoking process, your spell does not activate and your action is considered spent. If you roll a natural one
(1) on the d20 used for your magic power check, or if you fail the roll by 5 or more, in addition you gain a Penalty Level as well."

...and then get rid of the existing final paragraph, It references critical failures, a mechanic not actually defined in Fantasy Concepts.

Note that this is in no way official errata, as I am no longer involved in Fantasy Concepts, but this fixes the problem of spellcasters trying over and over again. Also, it makes 1st level spells easy enough for a 1st level caster to succeed more often than he fails, yet not so easy that a 20th level caster only fails to cast Wish on a natural 1.

Thanks for the feedback, EditorBFG. I agree with part two of your suggestion, and would suggest a simple DC 10 + spell level for instead of the twice spell level, to be consistent with the rest of the system. That makes it a lot easier to cast spells at higher levels, but then again, it probably should be easier to cast spells at higher levels.

Hope This Helps,
Flynn

 

[Animus]

Thanks for the feedback, EditorBFG. I agree with part two of your suggestion, and would suggest a simple DC 10 + spell level for instead of the twice spell level, to be consistent with the rest of the system. That makes it a lot easier to cast spells at higher levels, but then again, it probably should be easier to cast spells at higher levels.

Hope This Helps,
Flynn

In the True20 spellcasting system, you make your power check to cast your spell, and then you make a Will save vs. DC 10 + 1/2 class level round up or suffer a fatigue level regardless of success or failure. If I get a chance to run FC, I may do something like that.

 

[Daniel D. Fox]

Flynn,

After purchasing the PDF and playtesting levels 1, 5, 10, 15 and 20th level characters of all the classes through combat, consider me a HUGE fan!

There are a couple of changes I made inhouse (such as Armor as DR and AC=Reflex+shield with Reflex equating to touch attacks and a few Talent fixes), but otherwise everything is very well-rounded. I particularly like how you handled Attacks of Opportunity (which I was struggling with in my homebrew). I noticed you eliminated Acrobatic Strike, one of the more overpowered feats in SW Saga; kudoes on that! It was one of the most ill-balanced feats we've had running in my game for a while.

I did find some difficulty resolving exactly what to do with spells and the like, but overall the mechanics great and seem to remain balanced between the classes. The progression table for penalties/bonuses on the 1, 2, 4, 8, 16 model are very sound.

Any suggestions to how you handled learning spells beyond those that were gained through the Talent trees? I didn't seem to find any rules adjudicating as such (or perhaps I overlooked them somewhere).

Cheers,
Daniel

 

[Scurvy_Platypus]

Hmmmm. I bought the pdf, and here's what's leapt out at me in my spastic jumping about.

Page 86 says that the Fort score is = 10 + Constitution modifier + character level modifier + highest class bonus + other modifiers.

What is the "highest class bonus"?

Is Disable Device covered under the Craft: Metalworking skill or some other Craft skill? Opening locks was explicitly mentioned as being under metalworking, but Disable Device doesn't say.

I'm sure I'll have other comments or whatnot at some point.

 

[Flynn]

Any suggestions to how you handled learning spells beyond those that were gained through the Talent trees? I didn't seem to find any rules adjudicating as such (or perhaps I overlooked them somewhere).

Moniker:

First, thank you very much for the compliments. I'm glad the system is working out for you, and I look forward to hearing more from you on your gaming experience with Fantasy Concepts.

In regards to your question, which I've quoted above, I would refer you to the following sentence under the Arcane Mastery talent:

You may learn more spells by spending a day per spell level in quiet contemplation and study, followed by a successful Knowledge (Arcana) skill check.

The Divine Mastery talent has a similar sentence:

You may learn more spells by spending a day per spell level in quiet contemplation and study, followed by a successful Knowledge (Religion) skill check.

I tried to give control of any additional restrictions in that arena to the GM. For example, you could require that the character study a ritual, meditate on a prayer book, or study with someone that knows the spell the character desires before you will allow them to learn a new spell.

I did forget to include a DC for these checks, so I would suggest either DC 10 or DC 15, plus the spell's level, as your target. This depends on how easily you want spells to be picked up. If spells are especially hard to learn, you might even start with a base of DC 20. It all depends on how "low magic" versus "high magic" your campaign is.

Please let me know if you have any further questions,
Flynn

 

[Flynn]

Hmmmm. I bought the pdf, and here's what's leapt out at me in my spastic jumping about.

Page 86 says that the Fort score is = 10 + Constitution modifier + character level modifier + highest class bonus + other modifiers.

What is the "highest class bonus"?

Is Disable Device covered under the Craft: Metalworking skill or some other Craft skill? Opening locks was explicitly mentioned as being under metalworking, but Disable Device doesn't say.

I'm sure I'll have other comments or whatnot at some point.

Thanks for picking up the PDF, Scurvy Platypus!

In answer to your first question, each class has Save Score modifiers that range from +0 to +2. When you multiclass, you do not add those together. Instead, you take the highest for each category. So, for example, if you have a Warrior (+1 Reflex, +2 Fortitude) and you take a level of Aristocrat (+2 Reflex, +1 Will), then your modifiers become +2 Reflex (because Aristocrat is higher), +2 Fortitude (because Warrior is higher) and +1 Will (because Aristocrat is higher).

In answer to your question about Disable Device, I would refer you to the last trained use of the Craft skill:

Disable Device (DC 20): With a successful Craft skill check, you may disable a device. The actual DC for the skill check is equal to 5 less than the DC of creating the item (minimum DC 10), as explained in Making Items, above.

Essentially, if you want to disable a device that is created with metalsmithing, then you use Craft(metalsmithing) to disable it. If you want to disable a device that is created with stonesmithing, then you'd use Craft(stonesmithing) to disable it. That's the theory, anyway.

I figure that anything you can make, you should be able to repair or disable. If you can't make it, then you can't repair or disable it. It's just a simplified way of looking at things from a streamlined skill perspective.

If this doesn't work for you in your campaign, you are more than welcome to reintroduce Disable Device as a separate skill as part of your house rules. Hopefully, though, you'll give it a shot and see if you like the rules as written before you try making changes.

Hope This Helps,
Flynn

 

[The_Pugilist]

Thanks for the feedback, EditorBFG. I agree with part two of your suggestion, and would suggest a simple DC 10 + spell level for instead of the twice spell level, to be consistent with the rest of the system. That makes it a lot easier to cast spells at higher levels, but then again, it probably should be easier to cast spells at higher levels.

Hope This Helps,
Flynn

Will the PDF document be updated with this information? I am thinking of purchasing and I'd like to know if that will be kept "up to date".

 

[Daniel D. Fox]

Flynn,

As a designer, what informed your decision to remove Great Cleave and Whirlwind Attack from the 3.5 to OGL Fantasy conversion?

Cheers,
Daniel