Favored class bonuses: give both hp & rank

[Matthias]

Regarding the favored class bonuses of +1 hp or +1 skill rank, this was one of the first things I overruled. I said simply that PCs get both whenever they level up in their primary classes.

Here's my reasoning.

1) This greatly simplifies the accounting process with skill ranks. If as DM you are double-checking your player's number of ranks spent, they could legally be over the expected limit (including Int and racial bonuses) by as much as their PC's character level and there isn't a way to mathematically verify their math is correct, because there is no way to verify that bonus hp have been properly added in so long as the PC's hp total is less than maximum hp possible for that PC.

2) The matter of getting an extra hit point for a 'skill-based' character--up to 20 extra for a 20th level character--is not a big deal. My philosophy on characters with lots of hit points is that they make encounters last longer and make them more interesting; they let players enjoy their nifty tricks more often and last longer against more bad guys. If this extra hp goes both ways (for monsters as well) then the DM gets to bring to bear more of the monster's specific strengths & tricks themselves; versus picking out a monster with a broad array of spell-like abilities and maybe a customized list of class spells, only to see that monster toppled (or help execute a TPK) in only two or three rounds' worth of actions.

3) The matter of getting an extra skill rank for a 'beefy' character isn't a big deal either. I think that the built-in limit of character level as your max ranks for a given skill keeps bonus SP from being used effectively as a power-gaming tool.

 

[IronWolf]

How are you handling the extra favored class options from the APG? Do they get those as well or if they choose one of those they don't get the HP or skill point?

 

[Matthias]

How are you handling the extra favored class options from the APG? Do they get those as well or if they choose one of those they don't get the HP or skill point?

I'm not too interested in those alternative rules right now (nor in the character traits). I may reverse my opinion in the future but for now I would really like to be able to say such-and-such character of X class and Y level will have exactly Z amount of skill ranks.

 

[LogantheBard]

1) This greatly simplifies the accounting process with skill ranks. If as DM you are double-checking your player's number of ranks spent, they could legally be over the expected limit (including Int and racial bonuses) by as much as their PC's character level and there isn't a way to mathematically verify their math is correct, because there is no way to verify that bonus hp have been properly added in so long as the PC's hp total is less than maximum hp possible for that PC.

If this is an issue, I believe you have bigger fish to fry.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

This would never have struck me as a problem that required solving, but I like the rule. It simplifies things immensely.

 

[IronWolf]

This would never have struck me as a problem that required solving, but I like the rule. It simplifies things immensely.

Until you throw the APG into the mix. Then some more information would be needed on how to handle things if you wanted to take an APG favored class option and what effect that would have on core options.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

Until you throw the APG into the mix. Then some more information would be needed on how to handle things if you wanted to take an APG favored class option and what effect that would have on core options.

I was already thinking along those lines. It would give non-humans a pretty compelling reason to stick to their racial favored classes without outright requiring it.

 

[Matthias]

Early in the current campaign, before I applied the 'get both' rle for favored classes, I granted the PCs a free skill rank to spend on a Profession skill to represent their pre-adventuring life. Later, I factored that free rank into the bonus ranks everyone got.

It could promote backstory development if players were encouraged, but not required, to spend their favored class bonus ranks on skills pertaining to their 'former lives' as an non-adventurer. Whether spent on a Profession skill, or Craft, or maybe even Knowledge or Perform.

 

[Tovec]

Not sure if these points were made, if so disregard.

Q1: Why not just simply increase the HP/HD of each character class and not have to worry about the +1 for favoured class.
Q2: Why not simply increase the skill points for each class, and not worry about the +1 for favoured class.
Q3: Why have favoured classes? If they're auto increasing BOTH anyway.

A1: Generally speak most characters want more HP, so they take the HP.
A2: Generally speaking people who need just that one more skill point are happy they can get it via an inverse penalty to HP. (Choosing skill instead of HP.)
A3: Part 1, because it add (another) incentive to stick with the same class instead of multiclassing. Part 2, because without having to choose, it might as well just be a regular class bonus.

 

[Matthias]

I would actually prefer more multiclassing. I realize the alteration does just the opposite, but it is impossible to change back or drop favored class benefits at this point. I think that with an allowance of up to 60th level (witout any extensions past 20th for any one class) the players will see the benefit of diversification in multiple core/base classes and dabbling in prestige classes.

Maybe the favored class bonuses is filling the exact opposite role of what it needs to be, and should be put in reverse...give bonus HP/skill ranks/other benefits to PCs who multiclass, to represent the skill synergy and cross-class talents they are developing as they diversify their range of abilities. Mechanically, these extras might help offset the sacrifice of high-level powers (unless already maxed out) given up in the multiclassing process.