D&D 5E Feather Fall hanger on

[Croesus]

I'd check carrying capacity. If you're not overly encumbered by the addition of a bard's worth of new weight, hunky-dory. If you are, spell is suppressed and you both fall unless you can kick off the bard. That way, it's better to jump on the feather falling stone giant than the 6 strength halfling. Interestingly, this adds a fun tactic for suicidal creatures to use against feather falling enemies. Just pile on until they cause the spell to fail.

But, yeah, I agree entirely with both your requirements of a check to pull it off and the concern about action economy. As presented, I'd not let the Bard attempt it due to lack of actions. Next round, sure. And I'd call for an opposed check if the feather falling villain didn't particularly want a passenger.

Whereas I'd approach it from a slightly different perspective.

FEATHER FALL
1st-level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 reaction, which you take when you or a
creature within 60 feet of you falls
Range: 60 feet
Components: V, M (a small feather or piece of down)
Duration: 1 minute

Choose up to five falling creatures within range. A falling creature's rate of descent slows to 60 feet per round until the spell ends. If the creature lands before the spell ends, it takes no falling damage and can land on its feet, and the spell ends for that creature.

What feather fall does is change how gravity affects creatures. An affected creature descends slowly. An unaffected creature descends rapidly, unless it can grab onto something - a railing, a ledge, a rope, or a feather falling creature. Strength matters for who is trying to fight gravity. If the FF creature is holding on, either they succeed, or they lose their grip and whatever/whoever falls. If the grappler is trying to hang on, either they succeed or they fall. In both situations, all we need to know is who is/is not affected by gravity and who is/is not attempting to hang on.

Of course, this could lead to some silly results. Fay Wray falls from the Empire State building, but casts feather fall. King Kong jumps after her, grabbing on. Do they plummet, or do both go crashing to the ground? Hey, it's magic. And feather fall doesn't say "up to five falling Medium creatures", it says "up to five falling creatures".

Besides, it would be kind of cool to see King Kong floating down holding onto Fay Wray (or Naomi Watts, take your pick).

 

[5ekyu]

Whereas I'd approach it from a slightly different perspective.

FEATHER FALL
1st-level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 reaction, which you take when you or a
creature within 60 feet of you falls
Range: 60 feet
Components: V, M (a small feather or piece of down)
Duration: 1 minute

Choose up to five falling creatures within range. A falling creature's rate of descent slows to 60 feet per round until the spell ends. If the creature lands before the spell ends, it takes no falling damage and can land on its feet, and the spell ends for that creature.

What feather fall does is change how gravity affects creatures. An affected creature descends slowly. An unaffected creature descends rapidly, unless it can grab onto something - a railing, a ledge, a rope, or a feather falling creature. Strength matters for who is trying to fight gravity. If the FF creature is holding on, either they succeed, or they lose their grip and whatever/whoever falls. If the grappler is trying to hang on, either they succeed or they fall. In both situations, all we need to know is who is/is not affected by gravity and who is/is not attempting to hang on.

Of course, this could lead to some silly results. Fay Wray falls from the Empire State building, but casts feather fall. King Kong jumps after her, grabbing on. Do they plummet, or do both go crashing to the ground? Hey, it's magic. And feather fall doesn't say "up to five falling Medium creatures", it says "up to five falling creatures".

Besides, it would be kind of cool to see King Kong floating down holding onto Fay Wray (or Naomi Watts, take your pick).

Why is the Yondu "Marry Poppins" scene coming to mind?!?!

 

[Syntallah]

I'd check carrying capacity. If you're not overly encumbered by the addition of a bard's worth of new weight, hunky-dory. If you are, spell is suppressed and you both fall unless you can kick off the bard. That way, it's better to jump on the feather falling stone giant than the 6 strength halfling. Interestingly, this adds a fun tactic for suicidal creatures to use against feather falling enemies. Just pile on until they cause the spell to fail.

But, yeah, I agree entirely with both your requirements of a check to pull it off and the concern about action economy. As presented, I'd not let the Bard attempt it due to lack of actions. Next round, sure. And I'd call for an opposed check if the feather falling villain didn't particularly want a passenger.

Whenever some spell situation comes up that is vague, or outright silent, on a lifting factor, I use the caster's spellcasting ability to figure strength and carrying capacity. So, when the caster casts Feather Fall, use his Intelligence (assuming that's his spellcasting ability) to determine how much he could carry if that was his Strength score. That's how much he can keep aloft with his spell.

 

[Ovinomancer]

maybe i missed it but did it state that the bard cast the thunder spell? Seems like some folks are assuming this in their action economy lists. i could have missed it. It would change the assumptions of course and the availability of actions - likely no grapple check to hang on..

thanks.

EDIT: As for me, i would not want to go into adding some weight limit into that spell and so on... so would not be checking into encumbrance. it sets the descent speed to 60... no need to start IMO looking at other factors. its not like feather fall is a powerful spell in need of complicated sidebars to disable or weaken it for the game and as long as that spell doesn't start causing bigger game problems then (to me) this is just a case of an unorthodox. clever way to turn opposition actions around and benefit from an enemy choice. one of the basic principles of tactics is to use the opposition strengths to your advantage too. I myself would not be inclined to on the spot invent new rule/mechanics to an otherwise OK spell to thwart such an attempt. If i were going to add in some limit additional limits it would not be based on the strength of the falling target but on the already in game limit of how many creatures the spell can slow - and rule that if more than that number wind up piling on then that last "pile" is cancelled as far as the spell effects run. but even then you create a serious threat to those using the spell against foes with little or no rational control - like say frenzied animals/monsters of somewhat mindless undead and constructs. not a route i would like to go down... IMX that spell is usually a lifeline that sees limited use.

YMMV

Mostly so something like "the airship Kelly's over and begins plummeting towards the ground worn you in it. What do you do?"

"I run into the cabin and cast farther fall. I'll probably take damage from the ceiling, but then the while airship will only fall 60ft. toward the ground pet round!"

"..."

Now, you may not play with airships or anything similar, and that's fine, but word uses like this come up in muy game, and a handy way to deal with it is already there: what a character can carry is a good limit without inventing a while new Stuart of things to worry about. And that took me literally 2 secs of consideration, so....

The "jump on falling bad guy to save myself" is already difficult, I might skip it and let the opposed check rule (disad for the falling bard on the check), then again, if I plan on airships, I'm going to set a precedent.

YMMAV.

 

[Croesus]

Mostly so something like "the airship Kelly's over and begins plummeting towards the ground worn you in it. What do you do?"

"I run into the cabin and cast farther fall. I'll probably take damage from the ceiling, but then the while airship will only fall 60ft. toward the ground pet round!"

My approach would be a lot worse for the character. I'd tell the player that the character will take damage every round as if the airship were on resting on top of him while he's on the ground. In other words, it would be applying a few tons of force to his body. In other words, he'd be dead in short order.

It's quite simple. The feather fall spell is effectively pushing the character's body upwards. The ship is being pushed down by gravity. If the character's body can't handle that much force, it gets pulped.

But at least the pulped body floats slowly to the ground.

 

[Ovinomancer]

My approach would be a lot worse for the character. I'd tell the player that the character will take damage every round as if the airship were on resting on top of him while he's on the ground. In other words, it would be applying a few tons of force to his body. In other words, he'd be dead in short order.

It's quite simple. The feather fall spell is effectively pushing the character's body upwards. The ship is being pushed down by gravity. If the character's body can't handle that much force, it gets pulped.

But at least the pulped body floats slowly to the ground.

Yeah, that's a lot meaner. What's the damage for a 130 ton schooner-sized airship squishing you? Personally, that's not uncertain, the damage is 'dead'.

 

[5ekyu]

Mostly so something like "the airship Kelly's over and begins plummeting towards the ground worn you in it. What do you do?"

"I run into the cabin and cast farther fall. I'll probably take damage from the ceiling, but then the while airship will only fall 60ft. toward the ground pet round!"

"..."

Now, you may not play with airships or anything similar, and that's fine, but word uses like this come up in muy game, and a handy way to deal with it is already there: what a character can carry is a good limit without inventing a while new Stuart of things to worry about. And that took me literally 2 secs of consideration, so....

The "jump on falling bad guy to save myself" is already difficult, I might skip it and let the opposed check rule (disad for the falling bard on the check), then again, if I plan on airships, I'm going to set a precedent.

YMMAV.

If a falling airship fell onto the character, without feather fall, or rolled over onto the character, what would happen?

I would have no problem inflicting on the falling character whatever problems being pinned under an airship takes "during the fall" and then on the ground if appropriate.

But if the "airship" was an equally sized dragon with 1 200lb pack, one tick of the feather fall creature limit would give it 60 rate so, again, i come back to the weight does not void the spell even though a ton of weight on top of the chrracter might void that character's warranty.

But thats me...





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[Ovinomancer]

If a falling airship fell onto the character, without feather fall, or rolled over onto the character, what would happen?

I would have no problem inflicting on the falling character whatever problems being pinned under an airship takes "during the fall" and then on the ground if appropriate.

But if the "airship" was an equally sized dragon with 1 200lb pack, one tick of the feather fall creature limit would give it 60 rate so, again, i come back to the weight does not void the spell even though a ton of weight on top of the chrracter might void that character's warranty.

But thats me...





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So, you fall down (heh) on the side that feather fall always works, but may kill you if there's too much weight involved, but are against the camp that says too much weight won't outright kill you, but it causes the spell to fail? When I posted, I honestly didn't expect to be argued that my way was too nice to the players.

ETA: out of curiosity, how much weight does there need to be before you start applying damage?

 

[5ekyu]

My approach would be a lot worse for the character. I'd tell the player that the character will take damage every round as if the airship were on resting on top of him while he's on the ground. In other words, it would be applying a few tons of force to his body. In other words, he'd be dead in short order.

It's quite simple. The feather fall spell is effectively pushing the character's body upwards. The ship is being pushed down by gravity. If the character's body can't handle that much force, it gets pulped.

But at least the pulped body floats slowly to the ground.

Yup. Which kinda makes trying to feather fall an airship not an action someone is likely to try so it wont be a problem

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[Ovinomancer]

Yup. Which kinda makes trying to feather fall an airship not an action someone is likely to try so it wont be a problem

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Wouldn't the now pulped mass of once creature tissue no long count as a valid target for the spell, thereby both ending the feather fall AND killing the character? Harsh.