Land Outcast
Explorer
Just passing by and wanted my love for this project to be known 
Final Fantasy Zero: Design Diary continued
- Thread starter Mark Causey
- Start date
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
HEY!
I know it's been a while, but things have been a little crazy. I've got the equipment notes just about ready to go up, and I'm going to toy with the Resistance values for the jobs I've already released as well.
I know it's been a while, but things have been a little crazy. I've got the equipment notes just about ready to go up, and I'm going to toy with the Resistance values for the jobs I've already released as well.
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
This post has an attatchment that is the stat-blocks of four characters and the explanation of their abilities.
I've run into an issue with my hosting service ('cuz I'm no longer at the university where it was free.), so I'm not sure where these files are going to find a home, but I'll be working on it.
In the meanwhile, enjoy this tidbit. I hope to get a monster up and running soon, and then I can work some sort of test adventure for the post.
I've run into an issue with my hosting service ('cuz I'm no longer at the university where it was free.
), so I'm not sure where these files are going to find a home, but I'll be working on it.In the meanwhile, enjoy this tidbit. I hope to get a monster up and running soon, and then I can work some sort of test adventure for the post.
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
Yeah, I don't know much about 11 (or 8 for that matter. ). While FFZ is very much a hodge-podge, I would welcome any words of lore from the games while developing this, especially if you see an opportunity I missed. This goes for all the games, though -- if I've overlooked something you think is cool in FF4 or FF10 or whatever, feel free to let me know, and I'll see what I can do to work it into the editing.
I've attatched a revision of the Characters and Extras, and a copy of two monsters, and the "Combat Example" document. I've also attatched the equipment notes; though they're disorganized, they're what I'm going from. And the skill notes, though they're kind of vague (just relating them to D&D skills).
I'm already noticing a few errors here and there in the docs, but they're a good overview.
Here, I'll post how to read the stat blocks:
Character Information
All the information you need to tell what it is at a glance.
Name and Level: Analogous to the monster name and CR from D&D.
Gender, Tribe, Jobs, Levels: This line is for characters, telling you quickly what their basic building blocks are. Monsters, lacking tribes or jobs, usually lack this line, unless they're also antagonists.
Size, Type, Subtype: FFZ heavily uses the subtype mechanic for things, so almost everything will have some subtype. For instance, all things that are bat-like creatures will have the Chieoptera subtype, be they Animals, Magical Beasts, Humanoids, etc.
Monstrous Information
Provided for beasties so that you can determine if the beastie is right for your encounters and party.
Award Factor: This * the number of party members = award for the encounter. Yay!
Loot: If the creature doesn't carry the gil award, instead he will drop loot that you can sell at the market. This loot is also used in manufacturing items using the Craft skill and Synthesis (though I've yet to work out the exact system for this).
Habitat: As per the DMG, where these critters tend to live.
Pre-Encounter Information
Stuff you'll need before the encounter begins.
SPD: "Speed." = DEX bonus + AGI score - Weight. Roll this at the start of the encounter to determine order of combat.
Senses: As per D&D; usually only the Perception skill is listed, but scent or blindsense, etc., should be here, too.
Languages: What the creature can speak and understand. Animals can still understand their own "tongue."
Defensive Information
What happens when someone hits you.
Defense: Basically, AC. 10 + Dex bonus + Armor bonus. Passive Defense is 10 + Armor Bonus - Weight (no Dex; it's basically flat-footed). Note that there's no such thing as a "touch AC" in FFZ: Your Defense *is* your touch AC.
hp: Hit points. Includes any bonuses from armor or CON.
VIT: Vitality. I'm choosing to go with this term instead of AMR. It's just a re-naming, though, it does the same thing: negates damage.
WND: "Wounded." = your CON bonus. This is the point at which you become wounded, gaining 1 LP, only able to make a single action, and taking damage when you do (unless that action heals you above the WND threshold). This is the point your pixelated character begins to kneel to the ground.
SWN: "Swoon" = negative (10 + your CON bonus). This is the point at which you swoon, being unable to take any more actions.
Limits: These are those super-abilities creatures can unleash. NPC's gain LP by the same methods PC's do, and also by simply being slain: every 6 encounters, the DM gets a chance to unleash a monster limit on the PC's! This is partially why minions are useful for big bosses: they allow the boss to use most powerful attacks.
Magical Status
Magic abilities.
MND: "Mind." This is a re-named and re-worked RES score for those who have been following along. MND works more like Defense and AC does: it's a score the caster needs to beat. It's done the same way though: 10 + MND score + WIS bonus, plus any bonus from equipment.
MDF: "Magic Defense." MND score + Wis Bonus. This usually subtracts from the MAG of the creature casting at you.
MP: Magic points. This includes the bonus from armor.
MAG: Your MAGIC score. MAG core + Ability Bonus (defaults to Charisma), plus any equipment bonuses. This roughly equates to caster level, but MDF will resist it.
MAT: "Magic Attack" The same as your MAG, except that it uses 1/2 your MAG score + Ability Bonus. This is roughly like the DC to overcome a spell, and represents how well you hit with magic. When rolling, you must overcome their MND score.
Combat Information
All the metal that's fit to swing.
Melee: Like D&D: attack, bonus, damage, and "special functions."
Special Actions/Magic: As D&D; what nifty stuff they can do. Magic includes the type of magic, what spells they can cast, how much MP it takes, and if they get any side-benefits from it (like Elize's tribal ability).
ATK: Raw ATK score, as D&D's BAB.
GRP: Grapple check score; as D&D's GRP.
Miscellaneous Stats
The stuff that usually isn't as directly relevant in combat.
Attributes: AKA Ability Scores
Feats: Characters have only their Concept feat so far; monsters only have one.
Skills: FFZ characters just have a certain number of skills at a given rank (all skills are class skills). There are feats allowed to add more skills.
SQ: Special Qualities that don't fit anywhere else, such as the tribe/job combo abilities.
Orisha: Orisha give characters their limits; monsters usually lack Orisha, but some have them.
Equipment: If the creature or character has anything other than their naked flesh, it's listed here.
Possible Kinks To Work Out: The spells. Specifically, I'm not sure if the healing spells are going to give "too much healing." I'm enamored of having them scale at the same rate as damage spells, but being able to ignore MDF of their recipients makes them cure a heck of a lot more than enemies can usually deal. Still, this might not actually be a problem -- healing spells could be spread out among more recpients, making them effective mass-healing spells (at 1/2 magic for the second target, 1/4 for the third, 1/8 for the fourth, etc).
). While FFZ is very much a hodge-podge, I would welcome any words of lore from the games while developing this, especially if you see an opportunity I missed. This goes for all the games, though -- if I've overlooked something you think is cool in FF4 or FF10 or whatever, feel free to let me know, and I'll see what I can do to work it into the editing. I've attatched a revision of the Characters and Extras, and a copy of two monsters, and the "Combat Example" document. I've also attatched the equipment notes; though they're disorganized, they're what I'm going from.
And the skill notes, though they're kind of vague (just relating them to D&D skills).I'm already noticing a few errors here and there in the docs, but they're a good overview.
Here, I'll post how to read the stat blocks:
Character Information
All the information you need to tell what it is at a glance.
Name and Level: Analogous to the monster name and CR from D&D.
Gender, Tribe, Jobs, Levels: This line is for characters, telling you quickly what their basic building blocks are. Monsters, lacking tribes or jobs, usually lack this line, unless they're also antagonists.
Size, Type, Subtype: FFZ heavily uses the subtype mechanic for things, so almost everything will have some subtype. For instance, all things that are bat-like creatures will have the Chieoptera subtype, be they Animals, Magical Beasts, Humanoids, etc.
Monstrous Information
Provided for beasties so that you can determine if the beastie is right for your encounters and party.
Award Factor: This * the number of party members = award for the encounter. Yay!
Loot: If the creature doesn't carry the gil award, instead he will drop loot that you can sell at the market. This loot is also used in manufacturing items using the Craft skill and Synthesis (though I've yet to work out the exact system for this).
Habitat: As per the DMG, where these critters tend to live.
Pre-Encounter Information
Stuff you'll need before the encounter begins.
SPD: "Speed." = DEX bonus + AGI score - Weight. Roll this at the start of the encounter to determine order of combat.
Senses: As per D&D; usually only the Perception skill is listed, but scent or blindsense, etc., should be here, too.
Languages: What the creature can speak and understand. Animals can still understand their own "tongue."
Defensive Information
What happens when someone hits you.
Defense: Basically, AC. 10 + Dex bonus + Armor bonus. Passive Defense is 10 + Armor Bonus - Weight (no Dex; it's basically flat-footed). Note that there's no such thing as a "touch AC" in FFZ: Your Defense *is* your touch AC.
hp: Hit points. Includes any bonuses from armor or CON.
VIT: Vitality. I'm choosing to go with this term instead of AMR. It's just a re-naming, though, it does the same thing: negates damage.
WND: "Wounded." = your CON bonus. This is the point at which you become wounded, gaining 1 LP, only able to make a single action, and taking damage when you do (unless that action heals you above the WND threshold). This is the point your pixelated character begins to kneel to the ground.
SWN: "Swoon" = negative (10 + your CON bonus). This is the point at which you swoon, being unable to take any more actions.
Limits: These are those super-abilities creatures can unleash. NPC's gain LP by the same methods PC's do, and also by simply being slain: every 6 encounters, the DM gets a chance to unleash a monster limit on the PC's! This is partially why minions are useful for big bosses: they allow the boss to use most powerful attacks.
Magical Status
Magic abilities.
MND: "Mind." This is a re-named and re-worked RES score for those who have been following along. MND works more like Defense and AC does: it's a score the caster needs to beat. It's done the same way though: 10 + MND score + WIS bonus, plus any bonus from equipment.
MDF: "Magic Defense." MND score + Wis Bonus. This usually subtracts from the MAG of the creature casting at you.
MP: Magic points. This includes the bonus from armor.
MAG: Your MAGIC score. MAG core + Ability Bonus (defaults to Charisma), plus any equipment bonuses. This roughly equates to caster level, but MDF will resist it.
MAT: "Magic Attack" The same as your MAG, except that it uses 1/2 your MAG score + Ability Bonus. This is roughly like the DC to overcome a spell, and represents how well you hit with magic. When rolling, you must overcome their MND score.
Combat Information
All the metal that's fit to swing.
Melee: Like D&D: attack, bonus, damage, and "special functions."
Special Actions/Magic: As D&D; what nifty stuff they can do. Magic includes the type of magic, what spells they can cast, how much MP it takes, and if they get any side-benefits from it (like Elize's tribal ability).
ATK: Raw ATK score, as D&D's BAB.
GRP: Grapple check score; as D&D's GRP.
Miscellaneous Stats
The stuff that usually isn't as directly relevant in combat.
Attributes: AKA Ability Scores
Feats: Characters have only their Concept feat so far; monsters only have one.
Skills: FFZ characters just have a certain number of skills at a given rank (all skills are class skills). There are feats allowed to add more skills.
SQ: Special Qualities that don't fit anywhere else, such as the tribe/job combo abilities.
Orisha: Orisha give characters their limits; monsters usually lack Orisha, but some have them.
Equipment: If the creature or character has anything other than their naked flesh, it's listed here.
Possible Kinks To Work Out: The spells. Specifically, I'm not sure if the healing spells are going to give "too much healing." I'm enamored of having them scale at the same rate as damage spells, but being able to ignore MDF of their recipients makes them cure a heck of a lot more than enemies can usually deal. Still, this might not actually be a problem -- healing spells could be spread out among more recpients, making them effective mass-healing spells (at 1/2 magic for the second target, 1/4 for the third, 1/8 for the fourth, etc).
Last edited:
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
What, no response?
Kamikaze Midget said:What, no response?
I was going to take over a fairly high level party as GM and take them into the FFXI world and have them do some of the quests and city missions from there, and add in the hunt missions from FFXII. Part of the reason to do this was so that I could ditch the ludicrous DnD spell system, but keep the majority of the rest of the game which works fairly well, and use the great FFXI background and world. It would have involved the party taking some time off initially to retrain some things like learn the different spell system cleric > white mage magic, druid > red or blue mage magic, sorcerer > blue or black mage magic, wizard > black mage magic, paladin > paladin magic, bard > support white mage magic + bard song, hex blade > dark knight magic etc. Regardless for the most part the characters would have remained as they were in DnD. They wouldn't have had the option to pick up a support job, but at the same time native characters using the FFXI version of paladin, warrior etc. jobs who could support job had more restricted access to feats and can't multi-class, so effectivly equivalent.
There were three main things that weren't either identical in DnD or could be trivially fixed like changing how paralyze works to more reflect how it does in FFXI. First, metamagic feats needed to be changed because of the spell system change, although mapping something like maximize spell to +10 magic attack with no spell level increase like BLM get works for wizards, it simply doesn't work well for clerics who also take maximize spell but won't be casting much damage from the white magic list. Second, resistances and saves were a bit odd as almost everything magic is a will save and almost everything physical is a reflex save, with little to no fort save use in FFXI. Third, weaponskills from FFXI/FFXII don't map to DnD at all, but in Book of Nine Swords I found a lot of mechanics in there with their ki weapon powers that do fit very well. Although there wasn't much in BoNS I was going to take directly, a lot of the mechanics for how the weapon powers are used could be used easily to make the equivalent of FFXI weaponskills in DnD.
Those problems were relativly minor however and for the most part it was a drop-in replacement that would give a very FFXI feel, but stick closely to the DnD rules. The 75 level + merits system in FFXI was converted transparantly by dividing FFXI levels by 4 and having the merit abilities and spells available at level 20+ as epic.
Anyway, it seems that from the posts of yours I've read here theres 3 things I'd suggest. First is that by going after several games at once you're making a very large task for yourself that would be more difficult than breaking it up into several smaller tasks. Second, it looks like you're overcomplicating things and adding in a lot more new mechanics and rules than you have to which has a few effects, among them is that it's more unweildy and dificult to balance, and it'll be frustrating for DnD players to use because of all the differences. Third it doesn't sound like it will play like either DnD or FF. For instance your "abstracting out equipment and putting them in as class features" is neither DnD nor FF both of which rely heavily on higher level characters having access too higher power equipment. In fact it's a cornerstone of both games where many FF players spend ages doing the quests or finding the materials or unlocking the hidden dungeon to get the ultima weapon for each of their characters. Likewise in DnD the monster's CR is tied to it's AC and DC on saves for it's spells which are tied to the expected attack bonus and saveing throws of players which is tied to them having a certain level of magic items at certain levels.
I too am making a setting for FFXI. I'm using Iron Heroes instead of DnD though, but I once I work out work out a magic system, it can work with either probably.
[sblock]
For weapon skills, I'm adding a secondary token pool(er the concept is from Iron Heroes) based on BAB progress. Its basically Tactical Points. The longer you fight, you store it up. You can use it to unleash an elemental bonus(think 1d6 or 2d6 or ect as you level higher; the type on element is based on weapon type) with a powered attack. It also gives a bonus when used with things like "Aim" token abilities. The Weapon Master class will receive a small bonus here in terms of how quickly they gain these "Tactical Tokens".
For unique class concepts that don't fit in IH's classes, like Dragoon's jumps, wyvern pet, Monk's chi/martial arts, Beastmaster's charm, Dark Knight's Soul Eater, and spells ect, I'm using the Feat Mastery system(must read IH to understand this too). Basically they are limited feat concepts that cost a feat or beginning trait to get access to. Say if you grabbed the "Dark Knight" trait/feat: you can progress in the "Curse magic"(black magic enfeebling / dark magic), "Soul Eater", and "Blood Weapon"(I'm going to expand this into a whole constant ability).
Magic I also want to be feat based. Another thing I want magic to feel like is powerful, but limited... like a weapon. Spells like Wish won't exist. Spells while be balanced between the 6 main elements(with Dark and Light being very limited), so no dominance of fire magic like DnD. Also evocation spells will work like ranged weapons. While Charisma will be changed to effect "Will", Wisdom(name changed to Mind) will support a DR that effects elemental/magical effects(and will replace SR entirely, creatures with SR will just have very large Magic DR). This magic DR can be lowered based on whole well the spell-caster casts his spell(and his INT score).
Magic will be broken up into "Black Magic" feat masteries(Elemental, Curse), "White Magic" feat masteries(Cure, Divine/Protection), "Red Magic/Mixed" feat mastery, "Summoning" feat masteries, "Bardic" feat masteries(er, a bunch of song choices), "Ninjetsu" feat masteries(Elemental Wheel and Shadow/Enfeebling), and "Fate" feat mastery(Corsair rolls).
For magical classes, they will be much more specific compared to other IH classes. Black Mage, White Mage, Red Mage, Summoner, and Bard. Each class will focus on their related feat mastery, Bard will be especially different than DnD Bard. Songs will be more like spells that a Bard can know.
I'll probably make Skillchains and Magic Bursts possible.
Blue Mage(and Blue Magic) and Puppetmaster will be the hardest to add to the system because their concepts are so unique. I'm thinking of giving almost every non-humanoid a weapon skill or two, so Blue Mages can mimic them.
And that was just some random notes ;p.
[/sblock]
After I'm finish with my system, I'll probably make a system using KM's FF concept and DnD. Yeah, so the day after forever.
[sblock]
For weapon skills, I'm adding a secondary token pool(er the concept is from Iron Heroes) based on BAB progress. Its basically Tactical Points. The longer you fight, you store it up. You can use it to unleash an elemental bonus(think 1d6 or 2d6 or ect as you level higher; the type on element is based on weapon type) with a powered attack. It also gives a bonus when used with things like "Aim" token abilities. The Weapon Master class will receive a small bonus here in terms of how quickly they gain these "Tactical Tokens".
For unique class concepts that don't fit in IH's classes, like Dragoon's jumps, wyvern pet, Monk's chi/martial arts, Beastmaster's charm, Dark Knight's Soul Eater, and spells ect, I'm using the Feat Mastery system(must read IH to understand this too). Basically they are limited feat concepts that cost a feat or beginning trait to get access to. Say if you grabbed the "Dark Knight" trait/feat: you can progress in the "Curse magic"(black magic enfeebling / dark magic), "Soul Eater", and "Blood Weapon"(I'm going to expand this into a whole constant ability).
Magic I also want to be feat based. Another thing I want magic to feel like is powerful, but limited... like a weapon. Spells like Wish won't exist. Spells while be balanced between the 6 main elements(with Dark and Light being very limited), so no dominance of fire magic like DnD. Also evocation spells will work like ranged weapons. While Charisma will be changed to effect "Will", Wisdom(name changed to Mind) will support a DR that effects elemental/magical effects(and will replace SR entirely, creatures with SR will just have very large Magic DR). This magic DR can be lowered based on whole well the spell-caster casts his spell(and his INT score).
Magic will be broken up into "Black Magic" feat masteries(Elemental, Curse), "White Magic" feat masteries(Cure, Divine/Protection), "Red Magic/Mixed" feat mastery, "Summoning" feat masteries, "Bardic" feat masteries(er, a bunch of song choices), "Ninjetsu" feat masteries(Elemental Wheel and Shadow/Enfeebling), and "Fate" feat mastery(Corsair rolls).
For magical classes, they will be much more specific compared to other IH classes. Black Mage, White Mage, Red Mage, Summoner, and Bard. Each class will focus on their related feat mastery, Bard will be especially different than DnD Bard. Songs will be more like spells that a Bard can know.
I'll probably make Skillchains and Magic Bursts possible.
Blue Mage(and Blue Magic) and Puppetmaster will be the hardest to add to the system because their concepts are so unique. I'm thinking of giving almost every non-humanoid a weapon skill or two, so Blue Mages can mimic them.
And that was just some random notes ;p.
[/sblock]
After I'm finish with my system, I'll probably make a system using KM's FF concept and DnD. Yeah, so the day after forever.
