First contact - science or magic

[Quasqueton]

Are you saying that aliens and demons are gay, religious, idiots?

Quasqueton

 

[bento]

Ah. Well, the US Census Bureau says that in 1990, about 75% of the nation's population was urban in 1990. While that's a ways back, it gives us a decent baseline to consider. While there are some urbs in the Bible Belt, they aren't the bigger ones we've got. Do you really think that you can scrape up over half the population from there?

I don't doubt that many would think as you describe. But most is a pretty tall order.

Urban or rural, it doesn't matter because the non-bi-coastal area has been growing the fastest for the last 20+ years. Five of the top ten largest cities are not on the coast - Chicago, Houston, Dallas, San Antonio and Phoenix. It's well documented by the US Census that the West and South have been the fastest growing areas (http://www.census.gov/popest/states/).

As for evidence of what people believe look at the number of copies of the "Left Behind" series have sold - 62 million.

Link: http://www.usatoday.com/life/books/news/2005-02-28-left-behind_x.htm

 

[paradox42]

I like to bash religious idiots too.

All humor about obtuse interpretations of you last sentence aside, I want you to know that there are many religious thinking people out here that do not hate you.

Oh yes, I'm aware of that. I do have some religious friends who aren't knee-jerk holy-text literalists, and who are actually very nice people altogether. But thank you for the sentiment anyway. Actually the religious friends I have tend to bash religious idiots also, because the idiots give them a bad name by association.

Anyway, the only reason I used the term "religious idiot" in my post up above is because I figure no religious person who posts on ENWorld (or even reads it) would be an idiot, because (A) gamers tend to be smart people, and (B) actual religious idiots wouldn't touch a gaming site with a 10-foot pole thanks to the whole "D&D = SATAN!" thing. So it shouldn't be offensive to religious ENWorlders, who are well aware that certain segments of their religions just plain make trouble for everybody else.

 

[paradox42]

Are you saying that aliens and demons are gay, religious, idiots?

Quasqueton

No, not at all- but if they were, it would certainly make for an interesting First Contact situation!

Really, that sentence in my post was just general griping about the rise of religious hysteria in the modern U.S., with a qualifier to show where my perspective comes from. The rising hysteria certainly makes life difficult for the "live and let live" crowd, of which I try to be part.

 

[LostSoul]

As for evidence of what people believe look at the number of copies of the "Left Behind" series have sold - 62 million.

A lot of people have read Lord of the Rings, but that doesn't mean they believe in elves.

 

[Nellisir]

It would depend on how they act, but I'd bet on science. Religion is a funny thing. People generally believe they're on the right side of whatever belief they hold, and religious events will naturally benefit them (and penalize non-believers). So if unexplained creatures show up, there are only a few possibilities.

1. the creatures show up, walk around, and do nothing. No benefit, not religious.
2. the creatures show up, destroy stuff, and everyone suffers. Possibly diabolical, but probably not -- after all, why isn't your god saving you? Not religious.
3. the creatuers show up, help people, and everyone benefits. Possibly angelic, but why are they helping the nonbelievers? Not religious.
4. the creatures show up, help YOU, and torment everyone else. Religious.

I'll bluntly admit to being a sceptic. Magic, to me, is something that cannot occur by the laws (known or unknown) of the universe. So if it happens, it's nonmagical and therefore science. Whether or not we know how it happens is irrelevant.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I think that how they would be interpreted would depend on:

1) The media & dominant culture in the country where they appeared. Most Americans, familiar with Independence Day, Star Trek, Babylon 5 etc., would assume they were aliens, though a certain highly visible religious subset of the culture (many of whom have their own media outlets) might assume deviltry until proven otherwise. I can almost guarantee you that if they showed up at an Iranian Nuke plant today, they'd be assumed to be American or Israeli special operatives, regardless of their actual nature, until proven otherwise...much like 45 years ago Americans in a similar situation would probably have assumed they were Russians and vice versa.

2) HOW they appeared- both in method of appearance and visible physical characteristics. A silver needle drops from the sky at the UN and disgorges Brains in Vats atop humanoid robots, most people would guess they were aliens. A flash of light and a beautiful asexual person with big feathery wings and a flaming sword appears at the football game, and most people would guess supernatural.

3) Actions. While any significantly advanced tech is indistinguishable from magic (and vice versa, of course), beings that acted in accord with ancient legends (say, talking about Ragnarok, forging "magical" melee weapons to "slay dragons") would more likely be interpreted as magical beings (of course, the Trekkies would be trying to get media time to convince us to destroy the ancient temples to rob the "gods" of their powers). Meanwhile, little green men asking for directions to Arcturus would be assumed to be aliens.

 

[ssampier]

Ironically enough, I think the first contact would be via probes or small droid craft. So naturally we would think they're insects until scientist examine the parts.

As for individual interpretation, I think it would vary. Some will say "The End is near", others will herald as a "Dawn of a New Age".

I think the better question is how extraterrestrials would interpret us? There is no clear answer there.

 

[ssampier]

I'll bluntly admit to being a sceptic. Magic, to me, is something that cannot occur by the laws (known or unknown) of the universe. So if it happens, it's nonmagical and therefore science. Whether or not we know how it happens is irrelevant.

I can understand that, but it's not real to you. As someone already pointed out technology is magic to many people. With a spacecraft advances toward earth scientists will have plenty of theories how the craft is propelled and how the creatures live. Until the craft and creatures are throughly studied, is that much different from magic?

 

[Nellisir]

I can understand that, but it's not real to you. As someone already pointed out technology is magic to many people. With a spacecraft advances toward earth scientists will have plenty of theories how the craft is propelled and how the creatures live. Until the craft and creatures are throughly studied, is that much different from magic?

Erm, yes, I think so. If the craft exists, it's nonmagical. If it's nonmagical, then it conforms to the rules of the universe, and can be understood and replicated. Maybe not by us now, but someday. Unknown and magic are not the same. And while that is my opinion, I also believe it's one that alot of people agree with -- even if only in the skeptical, pessimistic part of their brain that they're desperately trying to ignore as they eagerly anticipate the Rapture.

Or maybe I don't understand your point.

I think alot of people will happily state that it seems like magic, but that doesn't mean it is magic, or that they believe it's magic.