First-Time DM - Keep on the Shadowfell
vagabundo
Adventurer
KotS can be a little dry with all its combat encounters - I haven't looked at the revisions, but I've heard they help. So be sure to inject some RP elements into it and don't be afraid to tweak the whole thing. I used it as a framework and it was great.
Coming straight from a 3e game I found DMing 4e to be a challenge, very subtle changes. Not sure how it would be coming straight from 2e to 4e. And there is the greater emphases on the grid and tactical combat, my only complaint about 4e is how difficult it can be to switch from grid to grid-less combat using the powers model.
Coming straight from a 3e game I found DMing 4e to be a challenge, very subtle changes. Not sure how it would be coming straight from 2e to 4e. And there is the greater emphases on the grid and tactical combat, my only complaint about 4e is how difficult it can be to switch from grid to grid-less combat using the powers model.
jbear
First Post
I found the Forgotten Realms version of KotS added a very cool element to the game. Bairwin, Winterhaven's successful merchant is a shadow cultist in Kalarel's pay. There is a church beneath his store. Also you can swap out Hobgoblins for Shades and Cultists and add some variety to the hobgoblins fought in the Keep.
I stole some of Lost Souls ideas (check out his AWESOME thread called something like Sandboxing in the Nentir Vale) and had the Mayor of Winterhaven being bribed by Bairwin to turn a blind eye. They held his prized and dearly loved racehorse as ransome (hidden in the Elf Rangers cabin... agh what was her name??)
I placed a half-elven paladin in Winterhaven brooding over a half empty cup of wine. He refused to talk until the Pcs brought hin the Mirror (found in the burial site). He was a paladin of the same order of those that fell under the curse of the keep. He awaits a sign to follow, desiring to clean the keep of its dark legacy and restore honour to his orders blemished name. Bringing him the mirror set off a skill challenge (which even included a good old fashioned arm-wrestle) in order to gain him as an ally. It also required the pcs to find more about the history of the Keep and thus hook them into the story.
To the keep itself I added some haunting effects. Any PC that failed a S.Throw vs Fear during any kind of rest would roll on a d100 table and something spooky would happen to their PC. They'd have to make an appropriate insight check or take some penalty (like losing a HSurge). Failing 3 in a row made things worse. succeeding 3 in a row resulted in inmunity forever. some of the spooky things were ghostly scenes from the terror that had happened when the keep fell to the dark influence of the shadowfell.
I had Bairwin try and buy the PCs off after their success with Irontooth and the Kobolds. 'I'll pay you just to leave. Just touch the statue of Shar and swear you won't interfair'
I had dark shadow creatures sneaking into their rooms at the inn in an attempt to find the mirror and the mayor took the body of the dead paladin (killed by Irontooth) and brought his body back to life in the cultists temple... when they refused to touch the statue of shar... well guess who showed his dead and bloated face!!!! Not to mention that evil elf ranger setting Bairwins shop on fire above them so their escape route was cut and thick smoke billowing down the stairs!!!
We had a great time withthis module. Just needs to be brought to life with your own variety of herbs and spices!
I stole some of Lost Souls ideas (check out his AWESOME thread called something like Sandboxing in the Nentir Vale) and had the Mayor of Winterhaven being bribed by Bairwin to turn a blind eye. They held his prized and dearly loved racehorse as ransome (hidden in the Elf Rangers cabin... agh what was her name??)
I placed a half-elven paladin in Winterhaven brooding over a half empty cup of wine. He refused to talk until the Pcs brought hin the Mirror (found in the burial site). He was a paladin of the same order of those that fell under the curse of the keep. He awaits a sign to follow, desiring to clean the keep of its dark legacy and restore honour to his orders blemished name. Bringing him the mirror set off a skill challenge (which even included a good old fashioned arm-wrestle) in order to gain him as an ally. It also required the pcs to find more about the history of the Keep and thus hook them into the story.
To the keep itself I added some haunting effects. Any PC that failed a S.Throw vs Fear during any kind of rest would roll on a d100 table and something spooky would happen to their PC. They'd have to make an appropriate insight check or take some penalty (like losing a HSurge). Failing 3 in a row made things worse. succeeding 3 in a row resulted in inmunity forever. some of the spooky things were ghostly scenes from the terror that had happened when the keep fell to the dark influence of the shadowfell.
I had Bairwin try and buy the PCs off after their success with Irontooth and the Kobolds. 'I'll pay you just to leave. Just touch the statue of Shar and swear you won't interfair'
I had dark shadow creatures sneaking into their rooms at the inn in an attempt to find the mirror and the mayor took the body of the dead paladin (killed by Irontooth) and brought his body back to life in the cultists temple... when they refused to touch the statue of shar... well guess who showed his dead and bloated face!!!! Not to mention that evil elf ranger setting Bairwins shop on fire above them so their escape route was cut and thick smoke billowing down the stairs!!!
We had a great time withthis module. Just needs to be brought to life with your own variety of herbs and spices!
Saeviomagy
Adventurer
As a player in this module, I found the following:
The kobold ambushes working up to an encounter with the kobold boss felt pretty natural.
The kobold boss turning out to be a goblin didn't make a lot of sense.
The goblin working for some sort of cult dedicated to raising undead didn't make a lot of sense.
The final bad guy signing all of his orders didn't make a lot of sense, nor did all his minions keeping the signed orders around.
How lame the final bad guy's spy was: no sense.
The portal containing some sort of hideous tentacle monster... no sense there either.
Finally, there were very weak ties between this adventure and the next.
I found that the amount of combat wasn't too bad. If you find that combats are going slowly, swap out soldiers for lurkers, brutes and artillery wherever you can.
Mostly the adventure needs a facial: the mechanics are good, the fights are pretty good, but nothing fits together with any coherence.
The kobold ambushes working up to an encounter with the kobold boss felt pretty natural.
The kobold boss turning out to be a goblin didn't make a lot of sense.
The goblin working for some sort of cult dedicated to raising undead didn't make a lot of sense.
The final bad guy signing all of his orders didn't make a lot of sense, nor did all his minions keeping the signed orders around.
How lame the final bad guy's spy was: no sense.
The portal containing some sort of hideous tentacle monster... no sense there either.
Finally, there were very weak ties between this adventure and the next.
I found that the amount of combat wasn't too bad. If you find that combats are going slowly, swap out soldiers for lurkers, brutes and artillery wherever you can.
Mostly the adventure needs a facial: the mechanics are good, the fights are pretty good, but nothing fits together with any coherence.
vagabundo
Adventurer
Wow, almost makes me want to re-run KotS. This is the kind of details that brings a setting to life - and WotC don't spend enough time putting in.
Nebulous
Legend
While KotS can be a lot of fun, an experienced DM is best to squeeze it for what it's worth, and slice out what's not so good (which can be a lot). I kind of agree with PirateCat, if you haven't started the campaign yet, i'd REALLY go with War of the Burning Sky. I have not run it, nor will i run it (i too far into 4e to start a new campaign unless it's Dark Sun) but from what i've seen it is excellent AND fun to read. Something that can't quite be said for WotC modules so far.
Aplus
First Post
thanks again for all your comments. the first night went really well. i ended up with a group of 7 players (1 leader, 1 controller, and 5 strikers). we did spend a lot of time in combat (3 encounters completed and the group has not yet made it to Winterhaven lol).
the group decided to capture one of the kobolds in the first encounter and learned of the goblin leader Irontooth. they decided to go dispatch Irontooth on their way to winterhaven. I tried to give them a way to avoid the second kobold ambush before they got to the lair, but they walked right into the fight anyways.
in the fight outside the lair, the groups assassin died (like the for real negative bloodied value dead) to a hail of javelins from the minions. this wasn't intentional, but was pretty damn funny. he will be playing a new character that the group will hopefully rescue from inside the lair in the next session.
i didn't have a lot of backstory going in, but since we actually played a session, i've gotten tons of ideas, mostly from questions asked by my players, and actions they took. we now have a kobold fighter NPC in the group, who's loyalty has been won over by the group's warlord.
the player's didn't really seem to mind spending 95% of our 7-hour session in combat. i did my best to give very colorful descriptions of each and every player's turn. i also did my best to make natural 20's and 1's extremely entertaining. our avenger gets to roll just about all attack rolls twice, so she had a lot of crits!
i really like the idea of using the framework of this module as a launching point to building a sandbox campaign in the nentir vale. my only fear is if i will have enough time to give it the attention it deserves (or more importantly to give the rest of my life the attention it deserves).
the group decided to capture one of the kobolds in the first encounter and learned of the goblin leader Irontooth. they decided to go dispatch Irontooth on their way to winterhaven. I tried to give them a way to avoid the second kobold ambush before they got to the lair, but they walked right into the fight anyways.
in the fight outside the lair, the groups assassin died (like the for real negative bloodied value dead) to a hail of javelins from the minions. this wasn't intentional, but was pretty damn funny. he will be playing a new character that the group will hopefully rescue from inside the lair in the next session.
i didn't have a lot of backstory going in, but since we actually played a session, i've gotten tons of ideas, mostly from questions asked by my players, and actions they took. we now have a kobold fighter NPC in the group, who's loyalty has been won over by the group's warlord.
the player's didn't really seem to mind spending 95% of our 7-hour session in combat. i did my best to give very colorful descriptions of each and every player's turn. i also did my best to make natural 20's and 1's extremely entertaining. our avenger gets to roll just about all attack rolls twice, so she had a lot of crits!
i really like the idea of using the framework of this module as a launching point to building a sandbox campaign in the nentir vale. my only fear is if i will have enough time to give it the attention it deserves (or more importantly to give the rest of my life the attention it deserves).
Aplus
First Post
i've also read a bit of the campaign guide for wotbs and signed up as a subscriber so i can look at the modules. i presented this module to my players as sort of a practice run, after which we could reroll and start over with something else, or possibly just continue if everyone is loving it.
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