Font of Tears or Moment of Glory?

[Kzach]

Which one do you think is the most powerful?

Personally, I can't pick it. Where one is strong, the other is weak so they tend to even out. But I have the chance to change so I'm thinking I might give Moment of Glory a go for awhile.

 

[corman]

Moment of Glory, hands down.

Don't have to hit to trigger the effect.
Effect stays on your allies, no matter where they go, as long as you sustain it.
Can activate the power BEFORE you open the door to the big bad guy's throne room.
Prevents minions from hurting you at all.
Stops all 'ongoing 5' damage completely.
Requires only a minor action to sustain, leaving you a standard and a move to to do other stuff.
The only way to counter it (from a monster point of view) is to stun/KO the cleric sustaining it.

It reduces the healing you have to do by a LOT, over the course of a fight.

Consider a group of 6 heroes with MoG running...if every hero gets attacked just once in a round, that's 30 points of healing you won't have to do. Over a long fight that equals hundreds of points of healing you won't have to generate.

MoG is the best daily available to a heroic tier cleric, period. Beacon of Hope is excellent, but MoG is even better in my opinion. Font of Tears doesn't even come close to MoG.

Note that Astral Condemnation does essentially the same thing for a single big bad monster, and stacks with MoG...

 

[Flipguarder]

MoG.

 

[Kzach]

1. Don't have to hit to trigger the effect.
2. Effect stays on your allies, no matter where they go, as long as you sustain it.
3. Can activate the power BEFORE you open the door to the big bad guy's throne room.
4. Prevents minions from hurting you at all.
5. Stops all 'ongoing 5' damage completely.
6. Requires only a minor action to sustain, leaving you a standard and a move to to do other stuff.
7. The only way to counter it (from a monster point of view) is to stun/KO the cleric sustaining it.

1. Don't have to hit to trigger FoT's effect either.
2. Effect of FoT has a burst 3 area. With a cleric staying in range of the biggest grouping of monsters, you rarely have a problem keeping the effect on everyone.
3. You could activate the effect of FoT before entering combat as well... although why you would want to is beyond my comprehension.
4. A -2 to hit can potentially counter more damage than a flat 5 damage resistance.
5. Ok, so it has one advantage, countering 5 ongoing damage.
6. FoT only requires a minor to sustain as well.
7. Only one way to counter FoT as well.

FoT, however, has the MASSIVE advantage of a burst 3 attack against creature's will's to daze them (save ends). Dazing half the combatants radically alters the battlefield. They can't make op attacks, so you can all move freely around, or retreat easily. Only one action means knocking things prone or shifting/pushing/sliding effects are much more powerful, and granting combat advantage to everyone.

Resist 5 is nice, but a -2 to enemy attacks is potentially more powerful as it counters effects as well as the damage, and the damage countered over the course of a battle could potentially be far more than the resist 5 does.

 

[Flipguarder]

resist 5 pretty much eliminates any damage a minion could do, as well as negates any damage from ongoing 5 effects. I'd be REAL hard pressed to say that -2 to attacks is better than resist 5. maybe if you are dealing with more than 3 controllers or several stun sources in an encounter, but mostly no resist 5 is just better overall.

 

[corman]

1. Don't have to hit to trigger FoT's effect either.
2. Effect of FoT has a burst 3 area. With a cleric staying in range of the biggest grouping of monsters, you rarely have a problem keeping the effect on everyone.
3. You could activate the effect of FoT before entering combat as well... although why you would want to is beyond my comprehension.
4. A -2 to hit can potentially counter more damage than a flat 5 damage resistance.
5. Ok, so it has one advantage, countering 5 ongoing damage.
6. FoT only requires a minor to sustain as well.
7. Only one way to counter FoT as well.

FoT, however, has the MASSIVE advantage of a burst 3 attack against creature's will's to daze them (save ends). Dazing half the combatants radically alters the battlefield. They can't make op attacks, so you can all move freely around, or retreat easily. Only one action means knocking things prone or shifting/pushing/sliding effects are much more powerful, and granting combat advantage to everyone.

Resist 5 is nice, but a -2 to enemy attacks is potentially more powerful as it counters effects as well as the damage, and the damage countered over the course of a battle could potentially be far more than the resist 5 does.

MoG pushes 3 and knocks prone on a hit, too. That eats a monsters move action standing up, and they grant CA while prone, and take a -2 to hit if they attack while prone.
A zone is easily avoided by ranged monsters.
A zone is easily avoided by dragging/pushing/pulling/teleporting your allies out of it.
Save ends effects last an average of one (1) extra turn against minions and standard monsters (55% chance of save every round). Against a solo or elite, they will last only 1 round, at most.
A -2 to hit makes a *difference* on a hit roll only 2 of 20 possible rolls (10% of the time). The rest of the time your -2 has NO effect. For example, if the monster needs a 15 to hit your allies, the -2 only makes it miss if it rolls a 15 or a 16 on the die. Anything else will still hit, or would have missed anyways.
To get the daze effect, you have to hit the monster, which may be difficult depending on your stats - MoG's DR effect helps your party whether or not you hit, whether or not they move around.
MoG allows your cleric to 'raise shields' on the team, then move to a safe location to sustain it. FoT means your cleric has to stay in easy blast/burst range of the biggest concentration of monsters to be effective...which invites them to counter your FoT by blasting you.

Under some *specific* circumstance, FoT *might* possibly be better than MoG...but the other 99% of the time, MoG absolutely rules. Use MoG in some adventures and see for yourself - it is far more effective in play that it seems on paper, bordering on broken even.

 

[DracoSuave]

resist 5 pretty much eliminates any damage a minion could do, as well as negates any damage from ongoing 5 effects. I'd be REAL hard pressed to say that -2 to attacks is better than resist 5. maybe if you are dealing with more than 3 controllers or several stun sources in an encounter, but mostly no resist 5 is just better overall.

Any theory about a Daily's effectiveness that starts with 'It's good against minions' isn't really a situation using that Daily to full effect.

FoT is -amazing- with an enfeebling smiting paladin against a large brutish foe, for example.

 

[Flipguarder]

That just seems incorrect. Maybe if your DM only uses minions in easy fights.

But if you have 8 ranged attack minions, 2 brutes and a lurker, its a great power.

 

[DracoSuave]

That just seems incorrect. Maybe if your DM only uses minions in easy fights.

But if you have 8 ranged attack minions, 2 brutes and a lurker, its a great power.

Good point.

Very good point.

Regardless, I think both have their uses, some fights one is better, others the other is better. But eh. They're two different classes' powers. It's not like you'll ever choose between them unless you M/C.