Forgotten Realms "Canon Lawyers"

[DaveMage]

"Fully versed" is a pretty high bar for DMs.

I buy a published setting because something about it gets my creative juices flowing. I buy it because any time my players say, "We head south. What do we find?" I can look at a map and answer them.

I don't buy it to spend hours memorizing trivia so I will know what secret door is hidden in what inn, and what the name of every blacksmith/bar maid is.

And that's cool - as long as you're not DMing fans of the setting who want a DM with more knowledge of the setting.

But part of the appeal of the Realms to some people (not you apparently) is the fact that it *is* so detailed, and in their imagination, they've practically lived there. It's likely to be less fun for them if you don't know the setting as imtimately.

Of course, if the players are willing you can always compromise. If all you are familiar with is the campaign setting book only, then simply let them know that if something is not in the campaign setting book, then it's just a rumor. (Maybe that secret door they think they know about is actually a trap to lure suckers [a.k.a. adventurers] to their doom - probably set up by the local thieves guild.)

 

[Nymrohd]

The very definition of Mary Sue is a character that serves as the writer's avatar.

 

[lrsach01]

Corner Ed at GenCon and he'll be glad to tell you about his frustration with DM's miss handling Elminister. Ed's spoken several times at seminars that when he used Elminster, it was never as a Deus Ex Machina but rather to anger or poke his players. Elminster KNOWS all but he does share that knowledge and is rather busy himself so he chooses to deligate some things to adventuring groups. I wish I could lay my hands on one of MANY interviews Ed has done... maybe I can later. Feel need to cite my information....

 

[jdrakeh]

Corner Ed at GenCon and he'll be glad to tell you about his frustration with DM's miss handling Elminister.

It may well be true that Elminster is mis-handled by DMs other than Ed — but I'd argue that is because in the novels that Ed writes, Elminster is an idealized, over-sexed, near ominipotent being who is better at nearly everything than everybody else in the setting and because official game products portray him in a similar manner, complete with 'special' mechanics all his own that allow him to operate outside of the normal D&D rules in ways that PCs (and other NPCs for that matter) can't. It's easy to blame bad DMs for Elminster, but IMO, they're clearly only a small part of the problem (possibly the smallest part of the problem).

 

[ST]

In literary criticism, if there are clear, obvious attributes to a body of work that the author himself strongly denies exist, then the critical articles talking about this stuff will often give the author's opinion. But they won't consider that a rebuttal in any way, it's just one data point.

There are a number of known quantities about the FR setting that are often cited as having been problematic for GMs in the past, and there's a number of factors that enter into it, from obsessive fans to supplement bloat to Hot Sexy Elminster Time, etc. etc. FR is what it is. How awesome and nice Ed Greenwood is and what a great GM he is is heart-warming, but not really related to the issues brought up by the OP. Set enough detailed guidebooks and franchise fiction in a setting and it can get choked and crowded no matter how it started out.

I'm biased, though, as I've intentionally never run any game ever in a canonical version of a setting. I respect people who love to celebrate setting detail, but it's not my bag.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Casual nudity (squick if you like) doesn't equal sex in Faerûn.

Here's a quote(1) from Ed Greenwood saying that it does.

I can say I've had to adopt a writing style for TSR novels that isn't what it would be if left to myself. Nudity has appeared as a substitute (under the old Code of Ethics) for sex

(1)http://www.defragsrealms.com/times/archive/ftedint.html

 

[Krensky]

An interesting detail I noticed regarding people's opinions of Elminster in this thread and the Mary Sue one, is that it seems to vary based on preferred play style.

I am not a Realsmhead. I enjoyed the setting, but I'm largely neutral about it and the characters. When I ran a FR game (about a decade ago) Elminster, The Seven, The Blackstaff, etc were plot devices and tools. That game was very narrative (in the sense it told a story) and the uber NPCs were useful for controling that. Blackstaff gave missions on one PC (a Harper), Storm fixed them up and gave them some hints after a TPK, etc. I'm essentially neutral on this, especially since I always took the view some of the Realmsfans here point out that Elminster is the narrator and is an unreliable one at that. "Just because Elminster or Volo said it, doesn't mean it's true or even what they believed to be true." That statement at the begining of the game stoped about three dozen canon arguments. They also speant a lot of time telling the PCs to go away and solve their own problems or that the party was how the powers that be were dealing with the problem.

The people who seem most vocal about the issues along with Elminster and the other uber NPC are those, and this is not a dig, whose commentary in other threads lead me to feel they prefer a playstyle diametrically opposed to the one I described.

I'm not trying to pidgeonhole anyone, it's just something I (think) I noticed and wondered about the correlation.

 

[Doug McCrae]

I'll say this for Ed Greenwood - although his writing is essentially erotic fanfic featuring a Mary Sue protagonist, at least it's not furry erotic fanfic with a Mary Sue. That's something.

 

[Melan]

I'll say this for Ed Greenwood - although his writing is essentially erotic fanfic featuring a Mary Sue protagonist, at least it's not furry erotic fanfic with a Mary Sue. That's something.

Damning with a faint praise, indeed.

 

[jdrakeh]

I am not a Realsmhead. I enjoyed the setting, but I'm largely neutral about it and the characters.

That really doesn't show.

The people who seem most vocal about the issues along with Elminster and the other uber NPC are those, and this is not a dig, whose commentary in other threads lead me to feel they prefer a playstyle diametrically opposed to the one I described.

Could be. I know that I personally enjoy a playstyle where NPCs aren't actign as quest dispensers or otherwise being used to force the PCs into some specific course of action.

I'm not trying to pidgeonhole anyone, it's just something I (think) I noticed and wondered about the correlation.

Honestly, I do kind of wonder how you reached this conclusion as there has been precious little (if any) discussion of playstyles preferred by individual posters in this thread or the other until just now.