Glitterdust verses Invisibility

[sithramir]

Ok so i'm making a sorceror who i'm worried will suffer against things with spel resistance. So i'm attempting to make sure i hav a few useful spells against such creatures.

Since glitterdust is such a useful spell i figured i'd take that over see invisibility (which i have 1/day as part of my race but anways).

It then occured to me that i'm not positive what happens to an invisible person when hit with glitterdust?

I mean they are still invisible but suddenly covered with stuff for the duration that givs -40 to hide. Is this person then considered visible for the duration my spell and then (assuming its greater invis or he doesn't attack) continues to be invisible? Or what happens?

 

[Nail]

I mean they are still invisible but suddenly covered with stuff for the duration that givs -40 to hide.

To Spot an invisible creature, you must make a DC 20 spot check. That -40 to the opposed hide check seems like that's a given, no?

 

[The Souljourner]

visibly outlining invisible things for the duration of the spell

That pretty much says it all. Invisible guys are visible for the duration.

-The Souljourner

 

[sithramir]

That pretty much says it all. Invisible guys are visible for the duration.

-The Souljourner

Wow I totally forgot that it was only a DC 20 spot check. That basically means some players in MY campaign can see some of my NPC's bah!

 

[Nail]

That pretty much says it all. Invisible guys are visible for the duration.

...But the way the text is worded sort of begs the question: "Is it still possible to be hidden if invisible and covered in glitter dust?"

And strangely enough, the answer is: Yes.

 

[The Souljourner]

Note that the DC 20 spot check does not pinpoint their location, only tells you "someone nearby is invisible". I believe it takes an additional +20 to the DC to pinpoint the location of an invisible person (assuming they are moving around). And you still can't actually see the guy, so you still get a miss chance regardless (you can just tell, by dust disturbances or something, that he's right there).

And sure, you can still use the hide skill, you just get a -40 to it. Good luck with that.

-The Souljourner

 

[Zad]

Glitterdust is a great spell. As silly as it always seemed, I've used it many times to good effect.

See invis tells you where an invisible creature is. Glitterdust tells everyone in your group where it is. You just need to get close thanks to the burst. And as a side benefit, every now and again something blows its will save and is blinded.

As for being "hidden" - remember that hidden is different from invisible. I could be hidden under a bed. Could I be glittered? Sure but it makes it hard to hide. Being invisible means you aren't reflecting light basically, but being hidden means you probably have something between you and "them". So sure, you could be hidden and invisible and glittered.

 

[Nail]

As for being "hidden" - remember that hidden is different from invisible.

Nope.

There is no difference WRT finding the creature. Using the Hide skill prevents you from being seen. The invisibility spell does exactly the same thing.

 

[melkoriii]

Nope.

There is no difference WRT finding the creature. Using the Hide skill prevents you from being seen. The invisibility spell does exactly the same thing.

Yes but you must "See" someone to see them.

GD makes it harder to hide but if they have total cover, you cant see them.

Concelment on the other hand I would rule you can see them as concelment is not physical.

 

[Nail]

Concelment on the other hand I would rule you can see them as concelment is not physical.

....as I'm reviewing this:
Do you have to make a Spot check to see an invisible creature in combat who has been coated in Glitter Dust?

Answer: Well, uhm...the spell does say they are "visibly outlined". But then it says that bit about -40 to Hide checks....This implies you must make a spot check, opposed by the opponent's Hide check.

But you can't hide in combat, right?

Answer: Sure you can. All you need is cover or concealment. You have effective concealment while under the invisibility spell. Creatures need a DC 20 spot check to "notice something is there".

...and especially given how the Hide and Spot skill interact when invisibility come into play......oh crud, does that look messy.