Gotham - Forged in the Dark - Playbook Ideas (+)

[Aldarc]

Also, keep in mind that Blades in the Dark often presents alternate sample starting builds for each Playbook with a moniker: e.g., Lurk (Acrobat, Assassin, Burglar, Daring Rogue); Slide (The Siren, the Prestige, the Grifter, the Spy); or the Cutter (Captain, Thug, Terror, Devil Hunter).

So you could still use the Ninja, Ghost, Cat Burglar but put them all under a shared umbrella playbook.

 

[Fenris-77]

Merging some of the playbook concepts upstream would have to happen, yeah. For now I'm going to look at the base model Blades playbooks and what they look like when they get changed to use the more modern actions from SaV. I'm not sure that will be the final answer, but it seems easier to start be seeing what can be done with what exists, and then create more content if there's a gap.

Also, do you want a playbook to represent a "gang", like the Mutants in Dark Knight Returns? While they had a leader, felt like the gang itself was the villain. Not sure if that would work in the FitD framework though.

I don't think that the FitB playbook really supports that as you describe it. That said, if you did the leader up using a playbook and maybe a lieutenant or two, and used the crew rules to represent the gang as a lot of cohorts that would probably work. You certainly can do a mook heavy thing with FitD. Even minus a specific playbook this is something that I'd write up as one of the factions in Gotham. In a lot of ways a version of this is how various mafia-like orgs would work - low-power leaders and lots of muscle and specialists.

 

[Aldarc]

I would take the opportunity and lean into the superhero genre for the names of the action, because this is an easy way to communicate setting and genre to the players. An action called "Smash," for example, is more evocative of the superhero genre than "wreck" or "scrap."

 

[Fenris-77]

I would take the opportunity and lean into the superhero genre for the names of the action, because this is an easy way to communicate setting and genre to the players. An action called "Smash," for example, is more evocative of the superhero genre than "wreck" or "scrap."

Up to a point. Smash really well works if it's hand to hand, but evokes ranged combat even less that Scrap. In SaV Scrap does both. I do agree that comics sounding terminology is a cool idea though. For example, the action results from that Marvel hack are Kapow, Bam, and Nooo!, which is fun. Once I have a definite list of actions I want to reskin and rename them in the name of genre appropriateness, same with the abilities. I don't want to lean to far into four color comic conventions though as that would be counter to the feel I'm looking for. I'm sure there is some middle ground there.

 

[Aldarc]

Up to a point. Smash really well works if it's hand to hand, but evokes ranged combat even less that Scrap. In SaV Scrap does both. I do agree that comics sounding terminology is a cool idea though. For example, the action results from that Marvel hack are Kapow, Bam, and Nooo!, which is fun. Once I have a definite list of actions I want to reskin and rename them in the name of genre appropriateness, same with the abilities. I don't want to lean to far into four color comic conventions though as that would be counter to the feel I'm looking for. I'm sure there is some middle ground there.

I forgot that SaV throws most of the fighting under the Scrap action whereas Blades distinguishes between Skirmish, Wreck, Hunt, or even Finesse.

 

[Fenris-77]

I forgot that SaV throws most of the fighting under the Scrap action whereas Blades distinguishes between Skirmish, Wreck, Hunt, or even Finesse.

Yeah, I'm not sure exactly how I want to reconcile those. SaV is my default, but it's not a perfect fit. For a supers game it might be appropriate to have melee and ranged separate. I also want to keep the the attributes balanced and I need to add in modern skills. It's a lot of moving parts.

 

[hawkeyefan]

Maybe Blast and Brawl as ranged and melee actions?

They could both be under Prowess, likely replacing either Pilot or Finesse, I think.

Or you could put Brawl under Prowess as the Skirmish/Scrap equivalent and Blast under insight, replacing Doctor, I suppose.

 

[Ratskinner]

One way to go is to add powers as a fourth action type, that get bought with the same points. So a starting character would have to sacrifice skills for powers (also perhaps an extra actions point to spend on CC). Adding in the above starting abilities helps there too. Using the Xenos idea to swap the starting ability (which BitD doesn't use as a mechanic) for a more power-y power would also work.

FWIW, I wouldn't "handle powers" mechanically much at all. Even with powers, they still fall within some broadband "wrappers" of how they'll groove their super-villainy. I would just leave the powers a narrative descriptor, maybe have a "Freak" playbook for those characters where their power/weirdness is THE thing about them.

I was also thinking that one change might be to not have a "crew". At least, in my memory, comic villains always seem to be recombining in new schemes/team-ups. So, maybe replace the crew playbook with a "scheme" playbook for the group. Also, betrayal seems a big part of the way villains work with each other (and a big way their schemes fall apart), so that should be anticipated, if not a part of the game.

Perhaps have a "State of Gotham" book, instead of a crew book. Downtime might feature the heroes "fixing" Gotham. So that, unlike Blades, instead of an inevitable march towards dominion over Gotham's underworld, long-term play is a tug-of-war with the heroes.

 

[Fenris-77]

I was picturing more of a three way tug of war, where the players have to balance gaining power at the expense of other criminals with trying to avoid costumed hero intervention. The latter is probably unavoidable past a certain point. Playing factions of against one another should a key component of survival in what is really a pretty overpopulated Gotham underworld. I wanted the game to start in a state of 'you can have what you are strong or clever enough to take" rather than having a ton of unpopulated spots on the map.

Your crew idea is interesting. I was considering some kind of shared goal thing that wasn't a crew type anyway. You know, revenge against Carmine Falcone, build a mad science empire to rival Lexcorp, rule the narrows with a iron fist, watch Gotham burn, or whatever. Something that would let the group have a little more say in setting the agenda and how they gain group XP. Unless I want to completely remove group XP there needs to be something there. The phrase that occurred to me was mission statement. Villains always seem to have that kind of motivation that drives their overall schemes. From a session zero standpoint that could be decided on prior to character creation, cast as sort of a "what kind of Gotham story are we telling", at which point the players can make characters appropriate to that kind of story. Having a shared metier kind of holds Blades together. I can see competing goals and betrayal working really well in a PtbA treatment though, and that would also be very cool.

Betrayal is a thing for comic book villains though. Perhaps there's a way to make pursuing your personal goals at the expense of the group goals a 'flaw' of some kind that triggers XP when you roleplay it. Somewhat like a vice I guess. The idea has some real potential for sure.

 

[hawkeyefan]

I think you have to keep some kind of crew element to the game. Sure, criminals double cross each other all the time in fiction, but you also have to remember you’re playing a game. It helps when the players’ characters are at least partially united.

My Blades in the Dark campaign had plenty of conflict among the crew members without any of them ever fully betraying the crew. I’d expect this game to work similarly.