Grading At-Will Powers

[Stalker0]

I just want to second that Piercing Strike is very good. A 1st-level rogue can fairly easily get a +8 vs Ref attack with this (18 Dex, use a dagger), which is pretty amazing.

Yep, piercing strike with a rogue's attack bonus is almost an autohit in many cases, I think its actually one of the best at-wills in the game.

 

[KarinsDad]

3/ Cloud of Daggers (it's a decent obstacle but very situational)
4/ Magic Missile (Ranged 20 is overrated. You'll eventually have to move up for the other powers)
10/ Ray of Frost (At will spammable slow? Mr. Brute ain't doing diddly 'til turn 4)
7/ Scorching Burst (AOE damage for minions and spamming)
9 / Thunderwave (Push everyone in the same direction and AOE)
7 / Illusionary Foes (Only vs Will and actually does something to artilleries)

Ray of Frost is not anywhere near as useful as you indicate.

Cloud of Daggers has many uses:

1) It often averages the most single target At Will damage.
2) It typically kills a minion, even if the Wizard misses.
3) It typically damages an opponent, even if the Wizard misses.
4) It can be used to prevent flank, or wall up a doorway, or other situational control uses.

Ray of Frost is a lot less useful:

1) It typically averages the least single target At Will damage.
2) It may slow one opponent for one turn which may or may not stop that opponent from attacking. But even if the target is not within 4 of the Wizard, at a range of 10, it is probably within range of other PCs, either with a ranged weapon or with a charge.
3) It might make it more difficult for an opponent to flee.
4) It targets Fort which is on average, 2 higher for most opponents in the MM than Reflex or Will.

Slowing a single opponent, one opponent at a time, is not that big of a deal.

 

[small pumpkin man]

Nah, if you look carefully, you don't add your ability modifier to the damage of either attack, so it's actually kinda crappy, IMO. Once your ability modifier exceeds 5, on average you'll be doing more damage with a basic attack than with Twin Strike...

An average Ranger has dex 18. At first level, basic does 1d10+4(9.5) and Twin Strike does 2d10(11), at 8th, when you get 20 dex, you will generally have weapon focus and a +2 weapon, making basic 1d10+8(13.5) and Twin Strike does 2d10+6(17), at 14th when you get 22 dex, you should have weapon focus and a +3 weapon, making basic 1d10+11(15.5) and Twin Strike does 2d10+10(21), at 21st, when you get 24 dex, you should have weapon focus and a +5 weapon, making basic 2d10+18(29) and Twin Strike does 4d10+16(38).

All of this is without quarry which also favours twin strike. Starting with 20 dex makes the basic slightly better, but not enough, and if you lose your magic weapon the basic attack gets a lot closer, but the basic attack will only ever be "better" as a bow ranger if you're without magic weapons, haven't taken weapon focus, aren't shooting your quarry, are below level 21 and have at least 22 dex.

 

[Arbitrary]

And if you get into a situation where you can't/shouldn't fire you can always bust out some melee weapons and have a chance at getting in some damage despite a likely low strength score.

Not many at-will powers have that versatility.

 

[Scholar & Brutalman]

For the Wizard at-wills I think the targeted defence is important. Kerberian's Monster Manual statistics summary shows that Fortitude is usually harder to hit than Reflex, and in the case of brutes is usually higher than AC. Lurkers are the only monster type where Fortitude has a significant advantage over Reflex, and targeting will is better for all types. The enemies you'd want to hit with Ray of Frost are the ones you don't want to get into melee ie often brutes and soldiers, and they have the best Fortitudes.

One note about Cloud of Daggers vs Magic Missile is that since it's an area spell it ignores cover and concealment - you just need line of effect.

For my human wizard (still at first level in KotS) I chose Scorching Burst, MM and Thunderwave. I've found I've never yet used Thunderwave, I've used MM on occasion and I'm spamming Scorching Burst all the time. In most of our fights I'm able to get 2-3 attacks a round with Burst.

f my DM allows the new illusion spells from Dragon 364 I'll probably swap MM for Illusionary Foes. Not only for the Will attack, but because it's the most generally useful against solo enemies. The defenders and leaders in our party will usually be in melee with a solo, so the slow from Ray of Frost wouldn't help much, while the -2 to hit will help keep the front line alive.

so:

5-7 / Cloud of Daggers (depending on Wisdom)
5 / Magic Missile
4 / Ray of Frost
10/ Scorching Burst
6-8 / Thunderwave (more useful for melee Wizards than my one)
9 / Illusionary Foes (some monsters are immune to illusions.)

 

[Matthra]

Nah, if you look carefully, you don't add your ability modifier to the damage of either attack, so it's actually kinda crappy, IMO. Once your ability modifier exceeds 5, on average you'll be doing more damage with a basic attack than with Twin Strike...

The only thing you don't add to it is ability bonus, this means weapon enhancement, feat based damage enhancement, and buffs provided from other players still apply. Doing d10s with no other bonuses you would need an ability of +5 to get the same median damage assuming a hit.

The only other ranger at will you can compare it to is careful strike (+2 to hit, 1[W] + ability damage), since the others are movement based utility powers. With 19+ required to hit careful strike has a better chance of doing damage (by 1%) than twin strike, at 18 and lower required to hit twin strike has a better chance of landing at least one blow on the target. Twin strike is also versatile, it works as well against the big baddie as it does a horde of minions, where as careful strike is more aimed at mobs with very high AC.

So I would give twin strike a perfect 10, versatile, powerful, and just plain fun to use.

Another perfect 10 at will power IMHO is Sacred Flame. No other at will power extends a parties endurance as much as this one. At first level its about a healing surge saved every three or so occurrences of damage taken, and it scales very well as the party rises in level. Not to mention the optional save can be a lifesaver in a pinch. The only draw back to this power is the record keeping, especially when mobs regularly hit for less than the temp HP amount. So its versatile, and powerful and not to difficult to keep track of as long as you use a token or something to track the condition.

 

[keterys]

Interesting how much of the response centers around the wizard at-wills. So, both cloud of daggers and thunderwave I assumed that you would have a respectable Wisdom, just for one clarification. Best to assume a power will be used to its best effect:

Cloud of Daggers: Highest damage at-will, Autokills minions and autodamages others, extra damage to swarms, provides a chokepoint, has synergy with other movement powers
Magic Missile: Longest range, gains bonus damage from bracers of perfect shot, can gain extra attacks with a warlord
Ray of Frost: Lower damage, slows. Problem is that its primary intended target's best defense is likely Fortitude, and the power has no additional effect under many circumstances (ie, when slow doesn't matter)
Scorching Burst: Only At-Will Area power. Otherwise lackluster, but this is a very big deal.
Thunderwave: Only At-Will that does not provoke. Hits a good sized area and pushes potentially _very_ far. While less respectable at low level, being able to push as much as 8 squares later with an at-will makes this the best at-will for _control_.
Illusionary Foes: Most reliably effective secondary effect.

Cleave - 4
Reaping Strike - 4

Weird, you think these are worse than Priest's Shield? Cause Priest's Shield is a 5, and I figured Cleave's minion killing and autohitting was a step up from a +1 AC bonus.

Similarly, I figured Reaping Strike was the best choice for difficult to hit solo and elite monsters and netted a respectable damage increase... I was tempted to set it lower than Cleave, but figured it was still better than Priest's Shield.

I think Furious Smash & Commanders Strike are both rather poor.

I'm not terribly enthused by commander's strike, but it is the equivalent of a Sly Flourish or Holy Strike that lets you add another stat to damage (Int in this case) and allows a warlord to use a one-hand and shield and let a 2h fighter type make the actual hit (or rogue, or whatever).

Furious Smash (and Righteous Brand) are both based on the fact that they can setup hits by your ally's encounter or daily powers that are worth more than an at-will.

Lance of Faith - should be a 7, as good as Sacred Flame, frequently better.

+2 to an ally's attack is quite good, but sacred flame's ability to give a save is practically on par with a utility power in its own right. The temporary hit points can also be a surprising amount of proactive healing. That said, I did almost make this change myself because lance of faith is more consistently useful, even if I like Sacred Flame more.

6 / Valiant Strike - should be higher than Holy Strike, 7 is good

Hmm, anyone else agree? Valiant Strike looks to me like the correct way to do, say, Sure Strike... a flavorful bonus to attack without losing the damage... but is it notably better to have, say, +2 attack on an at-will than +Wis if you're Wis-specced?

5 / Deft Strike - at least a 6, if not a 7. Being able to combine extra movement with a move action is fantastic.
6 / Piercing Strike - at least a 7, if not an 8. No other at-will targeting reflex gains weapon proficiency bonuses.
6 / Riposte Strike - should probably be a 7, extra attacks aren't easy to come by.

So, I set Deft Strike where it was based on the theory that Nimble Strike was more useful - you can shift 1 before or after the attack, and it's a shift instead of a move. Deft Strike's best use is for getting flank then moving back out, as far as I can tell... which is very good, but I set it 1 lower because it provokes and movement is only before the attack.

Piercing Strike is like getting a +2 to +3 to hit on average - more under certain circumstances. It seems to me like Twin Strike ends up more effective than that. I'll up it to 7 for now, at least.

I'm not seeing Riposte Strike at all - the target can just not hit the rogue again, and it's a strength-based attack that won't get extra sneak attack (cause you already hit). I mean, it's good certainly, but better than the other rogue at-wills? Maybe I'm missing something here.

*WARLOCK*
6 / Dire Radiance - should be a 7, it puts an enemy between a rock and a hard place.

Hellish Rebuke is easier to trigger and Dire Radiance targets Fortitude, the best defense of the melee types you'd likely best want to use it on. So I dropped it 1.

 

[Mistwell]

Nah, if you look carefully, you don't add your ability modifier to the damage of either attack, so it's actually kinda crappy, IMO. Once your ability modifier exceeds 5, on average you'll be doing more damage with a basic attack than with Twin Strike...

You are right you about not adding your ability, but just plain wrong on an purely objective level about everything else. Folks have run a ton of math simulations on twin strike, and hands down it does more damage than any other at-will power in the game.

I disagree with the wizard at wills

3/ Cloud of Daggers (it's a decent obstacle but very situational)

Situational? It does damage to the thing you cast it on, and does damage again on that things next round. It does more direct damage to a target than any other at-will power at the Wizard's disposal. AND it stays around so you can push more foes into it with thunderwave!

10/ Ray of Frost (At will spammable slow? Mr. Brute ain't doing diddly 'til turn 4)

Slow is much weaker than you seem to think it is.

 

[keterys]

So I would give twin strike a perfect 10, versatile, powerful, and just plain fun to use.

Another perfect 10 at will power IMHO is Sacred Flame. No other at will power extends a parties endurance as much as this one. At first level its about a healing surge saved every three or so occurrences of damage taken, and it scales very well as the party rises in level. Not to mention the optional save can be a lifesaver in a pinch. The only draw back to this power is the record keeping, especially when mobs regularly hit for less than the temp HP amount. So its versatile, and powerful and not to difficult to keep track of as long as you use a token or something to track the condition.

Twin Strike is the best of the raw damage powers, so I set it above the rest (2 points higher than +Cha for Sly Flourish, for instance), but I don't understand how it's versatile. It also offers nothing except damage, however, so I'd have trouble making it a 10. I wasn't factoring in its minion killing goodness so I'll up it 1, but... After all, Righteous Brand seems like it's far better (I'll just hit and... okay, ally, lay on your daily with almost no chance to miss).

I really like Sacred Flame as well, but its secondary effects feel like they're not always useful and it does do slightly less damage than Lance of Faith. It's certainly less proactive.

I'll admit flat out that I don't expect a lot of powers to get up in the 9/10 range, because, well, it's hard to compare to Righteous Brand when you get right down to it.

One reason people cited for lowering Thunderwave is because it's scary for a wizard to get into close range - while that's certainly true, it may not be as true for other controllers (imagine a controller who worked like the infernal warlock, for instance), and there are certainly builds (Arcane Reach, WotST, multiclass, eternal seeker, wizard / Iron Vanguard, etc) that can make it extremely powerful.

From my perspective, I'd have a hard time making a spell that was more powerful than Thunderwave as an at-will option for any class, and I'd have serious second thoughts about making one that was equal, too. Hence, my initial 9. I did lower it to an 8 cause I'm clearly in the minority there

 

[Minigiant]

My problem with Cloud of daggers is that is becomes a simple minion killer once you pass a few levels. It'll only deal Wis mod more damage than the other at will. At level 7+, it'll be 3-5 more damage and auto-minion kill. I could use SBurst for area, RoF for 1 turn slow, MM for range, IA for -2 to attacks etc.

Also take the feats into consideration

Ray of Frost is great with the 2 cold feat combo (wintertouch+lasting frost). If you hit you get +2 to attack and +5 damage for cold attacks. It'll be great when all your enc and dailies are done. And not all brutes high high Forts. And those speedy skirmishers and lurker have terrible Fort.

Thunderwave with Arcane Reach and Resounding Thunder gains some range. Add solid sound for defense help.

Illusionary Foes is psychic right? Psychic lock = -4 to attack.