Granted Powers in non-deity places

[Lopke_Quasath]

Okay, bit of a confusing title, but essentially my question is: If you go to a place/realm that blocks access to your deity, do you still gain the granted powers from your domains?

I know that you would lose spell access and hence the bonus domain spell, but is your granted power from your deity "renewed" every day, or is it a "part of you". I.E. it cannot be taken away.

Thank you

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Do you mind a clarifying question?

In what way do you mean, "blocks access to your deity?"

 

[Lopke_Quasath]

For example you go to a new realm (or series of locales) like Ravenloft.

Either somewhere where your gods don't exist, or a more powerful force blocks their influence.

Does that help Patryn?

Cheers

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Sure! And, I think the best rules-based answer you'll find is, "It depends."

In some cases, it's not unreasonable to think that a local god who fits the appropriate portfolio (and, generally, domains) might continue granting that power. Thus, while Sylvanus and Obad-Hai are not complete analogs of each other, they'll probably grant spells to each other's clerics.

Ravenloft is kind of an odd case, one which I don't know all that much about.

That being said, a cleric who grossly violates his code of conduct loses access to all class abilities other than the basics (BAB, Saves, Hit Points, Base Weapon Profs.).

Ex-Clerics
A cleric who grossly violates the code of conduct required by his god loses all spells and class features, except for armor and shield proficiencies and proficiency with simple weapons. He cannot thereafter gain levels as a cleric of that god until he atones (see the atonement spell description

Specifically, the cleric loses his domain powers.

This says to me that domain powers are a gift of the deity in question, and therefore are not "part of the cleric" as you say. If it were possible to completely cut the cleric off from his or her deity, then, yes, I'd say that they lose their domain abilities as well.

Keep in mind that this is, in many ways, like destroying a wizard's spellbook. It might be a legal tactic, but it's probably not going to win you any friends.

 

[Lopke_Quasath]

Okay, thanks Patryn.

I was going to take a level of cleric (have none so far) but my DM just told me that might not be a good idea since we are soon going somewhere where deities powers are blocked. Slight meta-gaming, yes, but my DM was being nice and didn't want my new abilities to be immediately useless.

That being said, I still want to take the level for flavor, but don't want to be totally useless. I was trying to find an argument that would keep my granted powers. I know spells are a lost cause, though. But, if granted powers are part and parcel of what the deity gives you, guess I am out of luck.

Cheers for the input

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Well, here's a trick.

There's nothing that says you need access to your deity in order to *cast* your spells (at least, not for most of them). You really only need access when you prepare them. Thus, if you've memorized them while you had access, you could then cast them at a later time, even if your deity was cut off in the interim.

There's some 2nd Edition material which basically scopes out the levels of spells and the deity's involvement. I believe it went something like:

0th-2nd: Cast by the cleric through willpower alone
3rd-5th: Cast by the cleric via energy drawn from a deity's servitor (planetar, archon, etc.)
6th-7th: Cast by the cleric via energy drawn directly from a deity

Maybe your DM will allow something like this to make a triumphant return?

 

[Lopke_Quasath]

I like the idea of having spells memorized beforehand and casting them later in the deity-banned location. Might try that on the DM.

Unfortunately, I can see my DM saying that the granted powers would "wink out" once I am out of my deities sphere of influence.

Wow, good ol' 2nd edition with cleric spells only up to 7th level.

I guess a possible conversion could be:

0th-3rd: Cast by the cleric through willpower alone
4th-6th: Cast by the cleric via energy drawn from a deity's servitor (planetar, archon, etc.)
7th-9th: Cast by the cleric via energy drawn directly from a deity

Thanks, I will try this with my DM. Of course, if we get stuck at that place for more than a day, I am SOOL.

 

[irdeggman]

Guess what - the RAW states that a cleric does need to have a deity at all.

Deity, Domains, and Domain Spells: A cleric’s deity influences his alignment, what magic he can perform, his values, and how others see him. A cleric chooses two domains from among those belonging to his deity. A cleric can select an alignment domain (Chaos, Evil, Good, or Law) only if his alignment matches that domain.
If a cleric is not devoted to a particular deity, he still selects two domains to represent his spiritual inclinations and abilities. The restriction on alignment domains still applies.
Each domain gives the cleric access to a domain spell at each spell level he can cast, from 1st on up, as well as a granted power. The cleric gets the granted powers of both the domains selected.

With access to two domain spells at a given spell level, a cleric prepares one or the other each day in his domain spell slot. If a domain spell is not on the cleric spell list, a cleric can prepare it only in his domain spell slot.

Similar to paladins not worshipping a particular deity but a principal that governs their life and actions.

Seems to me that this is the way to get around the set up your DM is planning on using. Gosh if he is denying access to clerical spells he has severly hampered a party by removing the core of their curing abilities.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Guess what - the RAW states that a cleric does need to have a deity at all.

...

Seems to me that this is the way to get around the set up your DM is planning on using. Gosh if he is denying access to clerical spells he has severly hampered a party by removing the core of their curing abilities.

Except that, in many cases, clerics are required to have deities. It is a fairly common house rule, in addition to being the RAW for the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting and, similarly, for the Eberron Campaign Setting (where non-deity clerics draw their power from the Ring of Siberys).

 

[FEADIN]

Grant Spells: A deity automatically grants spells and domain powers to mortal divine spellcasters who pray to it. Most deities can grant spells from the cleric spell list, the ranger spell list, and from three or more domains. Deities with levels in the druid class can grant spells from the druid spell list, and deities with paladin levels can grant spells from the paladin spell list. A deity can withhold spells from any particular mortal as a free action; once a spell has been granted, it remains in the mortal’s mind until expended.

No need for Deity after the prayer.