"Greying" up the Greyhawk Gods

[Lord Pendragon]

Is that greying up, or blacking up?

Because if all you do is greying up, then Erythnull, Nerull, Vecna and co. should be less evil than they are. And thus more accepted by society, their churches more present and respected...

I agree. Adding ambiguity (if that's the goal) cuts both ways.

 

[LostSoul]

Is that greying up, or blacking up?

Because if all you do is greying up, then Erythnull, Nerull, Vecna and co. should be less evil than they are. And thus more accepted by society, their churches more present and respected...

That's interesting. Perhaps these Evil Gods have a more benign public face than is assumed. You may go to the God of Slaughter for a boon before facing a battle against a hated enemy. Or to Vecna to uncover some ancient secret or spell.

 

[reanjr]

That's interesting. Perhaps these Evil Gods have a more benign public face than is assumed. You may go to the God of Slaughter for a boon before facing a battle against a hated enemy. Or to Vecna to uncover some ancient secret or spell.

That's pretty much how I treat all gods in all campaigns. Who would actually go out of their way to worship an evil god if they were entirely, irredeemably evil? (Besides PCs)

Evil gods should always have a place in society. If you are the type to keep your alignments... aligned, then you can add a neutral aspect to each evil god. For instance, in Dragonlance, Zeboim is the chaotic evil goddess of the sea, but sailors still payed her homage and sacrifices when setting out. She didn't only have wacky, murderous, sea cultists running around.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

For instance, in Dragonlance, Zeboim is the chaotic evil goddess of the sea, but sailors still payed her homage and sacrifices when setting out. She didn't only have wacky, murderous, sea cultists running around.

I imagine those sailors are paying homage out of fear, not reverence, though. They fear her power, so they try to get on her good side before beginning a sea voyage. It doesn't mean they're singing hymns in her choir, if you know what I mean.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

I think allowing open temples of evil deities is an essential ingredient of any grey-toned fantasy setting. That doesn't mean that everyone knows what goes on inside Erythnul's temple, or would be comfortable working with a servant of Vecna - but, socially, these religions would not be persecuted, and many of them would probably have a very strong influence upon society.

I can easily imagine Hextor's clergy sitting at the same ruler's advisory table as Heironeous' clergy, and agreeing on many points with the priests of St Cuthbert.

Similarly, why not take something of a leaf from Planescape's book and have Nerull's temples perform a service similar to that of the Dustmen in Sigil? Burial rites for those whose heirs are too poor to afford it, made all the more attractive by the possibility of willing oneself to the temple to be raised as a zombie. Your family gets a sizeable fee in return - it's possibly the only inheritance the average peasant labourer can really give to his family, and it's not like they ever have to see your corpse toiling in the temple.

Many of the evil deities could moderate their public face to a more neutral model for the sake of the access that social acceptance affords them to the hearts and minds of the common people.

Sure, Pelor might preach that selling one's departed family members to Nerull's temple is giving in to evil, but they can't match Nerull's price - and another essential component of a grey-hued setting is the futility of the efforts that the good-aligned take to combat evil. If Pelor's clergy refuse to stoop to outbidding Nerull's servants for the dead, that just cements their irrelevancy in most people's minds - and ensures their failure.

 

[LostSoul]

some great ideas

Some really good stuff!