D&D General The Greyhawk Pantheon: How Greyhawk Approaches Deities (& Demigods)

[Snarf Zagyg]

In terms of "why did they put together this table, with these gods?" Jame Wyatt in his recent interview of the Cosmology chapter pointed out that the Greyhawk Gazateer follows the advice from the DMs Toolkit chapter, and uses the Great Wheel as a chestsheet: go around the Great Wheel, and assign a deity to each of the Planes. That's why they don't give them alignments, but do give them home Planes: that's how they recommend people homebrew a pantheon.

I thought it was just an intense hatred of Baklunish and Suel deities....

75% of the Baklunish deities got, um, devastated. Probably invoked.

And despite the fact that WoTC couldn't cut the Kord (I'm here all week, and you can catch me next week in the Catskills!) ... they Rained Fire down on 10 of the 13 deities.

But the designers do love some dessert, and ordered extra cannoli .... FLAN. I am sure Allitur has got be saying, "What the eff did I do????"

(I kid, good catch)

 

[Parmandur]

I thought it was just an intense hatred of Baklunish and Suel deities....

75% of the Baklunish deities got, um, devastated. Probably invoked.

And despite the fact that WoTC couldn't cut the Kord (I'm here all week, and you can catch me next week in the Catskills!) ... they Rained Fire down on 10 of the 13 deities.

But the designers do love some dessert, and ordered extra cannoli .... FLAN. I am sure Allitur has got be saying, "What the eff did I do????"

(I kid, good catch)

They do double up a couple (Pholtus, Ulaanbaatar, and Cuthbert are all up in Arcadia together, and Hextor and Wee Jas have to fight over Acheron), but it is certainly an interesting short-hand for how to ratchet up a flavorful cast if deities without overly pedantic "now make one for Lightning" or most other checklists I've seen.

 

[Neonchameleon]

3. The Pantheon of Greyhawk

Before getting into the actual pantheon, a reminder- Gygax was always human-centric. So the deities in Greyhawk were traditionally deities for humans. Non-humans had slim pickings. That's something I assume people will want to change. In addition, Gygax divided the deities into four groups- those that were widely worshipped by all, and those that were primarily worshipped by one of the main human heritages (Baklunish, Oerdian, Suel, and Flan). That is why there is occasionally some overlap between the gods. Finally, there are three gods that are just, um, there (Ulaa, Wastri, and Thari... SHUT YER PIE HOLE!).

So, what is the "Greyhawk Pantheon" (as of 1983)? This doesn't include the "non-human" deities. Sorry, Raxivort.

Allitur (ethics, Good)
Atroa (spring, Good)
Beltar (malice, Evil)
Beory (Oerth Mother, Good)
Berei (family, Good)
Blerred (mines, Neutral)
Boccob (magic, Neutral)
Bralm (industriousness, Good)
Celestian (stars, Neutral)
Delleb (reason, Good)
Ehlonna (forests, Good)
Erythnul (slaughter, Evil)
Fharlanghn (travel, Neutral)
Fortubo (stone, Good)
Geshtai (rivers, Good)
Heironeous (chivalry, Good)
Hextor (war, Evil)
Incabulos (plague, Evil)
Istus (fate, Neutral)
Iuz (oppression, Evil)
Joramy (volcanoes, Good)
Kord (athletics, Good)
Kurell (jealousy, Neutral)
Lendor (time, Neutral)
Lirr (poetry, Good)
Llerg (beasts, Neutral)
Myhriss (love, Good)
Nerull (death, Evil)
Norebo (luck, Neutral)
Obad-hai (nature, Neutral)
Olidammara (music, Neutral)
Pelor (sun, Good)
Phaulkon (air, Good)
Phyton (beauty, Good)
Pholtus (resolution, Good)
Procan (oceans, Good)
Pyremius (murder, Evil)
Ralishaz (madness, Evil)
Rao (peace, Good)
Rudd (luck, Neutral)
St. Cuthbert (forthrightness, Good)
Syrul (deceit, Evil)
NOT GONNA WRITE IT (eternal darkness, Evil)
Trithereon (liberty, Good)
Ulaa (hills, Good)
Wastri (bigotry, Evil)
Xan Yae (shadows, Neutral)
Zagyg (humor, Good)
Zuoken (physical & mental mastery, Neutral)

If you add in quasi-deities, you can see ... that's a lot! Now, I will admit, not all the names are equally ... compelling today. St. Cuthbert, I'm looking at you. But it's a fascinating list. The other important thing to recognize is that Greyhawk (and Gygax) embraced an idea of "muscular neutrality," which meant that, for example, not all "good" deities were the same type of good. Pholtus, for example, was known for rigidity. Zagyg, of course, was a mortal who became so powerful he rose to godhood. And Iuz ... well, he's a god and he's busy meddling in the affairs of Greyhawk.

The basic point of all of this is that the pantheon of Greyhawk is .... LARGE ... and that the nature of divinity in Greyhawk is traditionally more porous than what we are used to seeing. But with all that in mind, feel free to use whatever works best for your Greyhawk!

Looking at that list I see a lot - and I see a huge swathe of gaps. There seem to only be deities for adventurers there and not e.g. a Goddess of Hearth & Home or one of Harvest. The sort that most people would pray to for everyday things. In the Nentir Vale (which is very like a 2000s update of Greyhawk without so many gazzetteers in many ways) this is explained; in the Dawn War the deities behaved like literal adventuring groups (which leads to the "Better keep Erathis on side with her experiments in civilisation").

And who do you go to for knowledge not about arcane magic? He who shall not be named?

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Looking at that list I see a lot - and I see a huge swathe of gaps. There seem to only be deities for adventurers there and not e.g. a Goddess of Hearth & Home or one of Harvest. The sort that most people would pray to for everyday things. In the Nentir Vale (which is very like a 2000s update of Greyhawk without so many gazzetteers in many ways) this is explained; in the Dawn War the deities behaved like literal adventuring groups (which leads to the "Better keep Erathis on side with her experiments in civilisation").

And who do you go to for knowledge not about arcane magic? He who shall not be named?

I used the abbreviated version.

There are gods of the harvest (Wenta) Home & Hearth & Agriculture (Beory, Berei) and so on.

There are gods of non-arcane knowledge (Lydia, Delleb) and on and on.

If you look at the full list in the '83 set, you have gods for everything from business to brawling, salt to tedium, propriety to poetry, gambling to law, weather to water travel*, sports to wine.

I just really didn't want to type out all of the things that the gods covered. EVEN I HAVE LIMITS!


*Weirdly, the god of water travel also has a side hustle with money and business.

 

[haakon1]

My Norse style deities are reduced in power after bringing barbarians and dwarves to the realm after escaping an apocalypse on another world ages ago.

Aegir lives as an old man in the same fishing village that has a statue to him facing the sea. Players caught on after seeing statues in other places that resembled him.

Other Norse hang around area and visit him on occasion. He mostly fishes.

In my Greyhawk campaigns:

Suel pantheon = Wee-Jas etc. + Norse (all pantheons from AD&D Deities & Demigods). Thor is pretty popular with players, and Tyr, Heimdall, and Odin come up too.

Baklunish = Xan Yae etc. + Greek.

Flannae = Rao etc. + American Indian + Sumerian. The Coyote trickster is the most popular.

Oeridian = Greyhawk pantheon.

 

[grodog]

The Norse and Greek pantheons (and probably Egyptian too) were part of the original Greyhawk campaign in Lake Geneva, so they’re definitely a “good fit” in Oerth.

I have the Greek (and Norse, although they have not been encountered in-game yet) as invasive pantheons proselytizing in the Flanaess, from their home planes in nearby Primes.

Allan.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

The Norse and Greek pantheons (and probably Egyptian too) were part of the original Greyhawk campaign in Lake Geneva, so they’re definitely a “good fit” in Oerth.

I have the Greek (and Norse, although they have not been encountered in-game yet) as invasive pantheons proselytizing in the Flanaess, from their home planes in nearby Primes.

Allan.

If you're going real Gygaxian old school, it should just be Pholtus, St. Cuthbert. and CROM!

Crom, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it. No one, not even you, will remember if we were good men or bad. Why we fought, or why we died. All that matters is that one stood against all of them. That's what's important! Valor pleases you, Crom... so grant me one request. Grant me the strength to kill all of those bards! And if you do not listen, then to HELL with you!

 

[haakon1]

from their home planes in nearby Primes..

I haven’t done alternate Primes, but I think about other planets in the PMP.

• Before taking on the Nodes in TOEE, my players did research. One found a book (all handwritten in my Greyhawk) about travels to other worlds including references to FR, Middle Earth, and Nentir Vale.
• One PC (of a player who wanted to drop out for now) was patrolling on his own in the Fire Node near an exit portal, after an earlier run in with the bandits, and their cleric hit him with Dismissal before escaping. He got the 70% chance (in 3.5e) of going to his home plane, but I had a table for which planet and he got FR. I randomly determined the location and he’s near the setting of a 4e elemental cult module, so that’s fun. They checked in via Sending.

 

[haakon1]

If you're going real Gygaxian old school, it should just be Pholtus, St. Cuthbert. and CROM!

I was thinking maybe Hyboria could be Gonduria, but the TSR Conan & Red Sonja adventures are not on PDF, expensive, and probably don’t have much source material.

I was surprised to learn TSR also made an unrelated Conan RPG ~1985. Same issues, except they do apparently have some pages about the setting.

I don’t care enough about Gonduria to pursue it further … for now.

 

[grodog]

I haven’t done alternate Primes, but I think about other planets in the PMP.

Sounds like fun! My Primes are sketched out at Planar Architecture for grodog's Current Greyhawk Campaigns

Allan.