Hawken said:
For my own game, I've trimmed down the skill list quite a bit. One example is merging Balance, Escape Artist and Tumble into Agility. I think I have somewhere around 22-25 skills.
What I've done is keep the skill points the same with the exception that those classes that get 2 points / level now get 4. Everything else stays the same. My players all seem happy with this and have had no problems (that they've mentioned) in having enough skill points to allocate.
They don't "need" a high intelligence to get enough skill points, but just about everyone ends up with at least a 12 in Int to get at least some bonus.
I dont know why you lumped in escape artist, those to me dont go together. Boosting the 2's and leaving the 4's seems neglectful. Personally I'd up them to 5 (6 seems excessive)
Aust Diamondew said:
I'd recommend if you specifically lower the amount of skill points some classes get (and not lowering others) to give them something to make up for it.
Force instance if you lower ranger and rogue skill points by 2 bump their hit dice up one size (to a d10 and a d8 respectively).
I've thought about this question my self before, unfortunatly I never get around to clumping the skills together.
No offense, but that Idea is TERRIBLE. having 2 skill points per level is just awful, the ranger is too good already to get boosted to fighter hd that cheap, and enh I dont think the rogue needs the HD boost. thats what the factotum(Dungeonscape) and my
adventurer class are for. The rogue is supposed to be more stealthy, and well, 2 skill points isnt worth a HD type.
Nadaka said:
One of the flaws of D&D is that every single class has been left starving for skill points.
Even the rogue at 8 skill points can not meet its basic skills without a high intelligence modifier. Hide, MS, spot, listen, search, disable device, open lock, slight of hand. Thats the 9 skills/level that a human rogue gets. No room for climb, bluff, tumble, balance, intimidate, knowledge: local, etc.
Powergaming is specialization. You shouldnt be able to take all those every level and max them out. Rogues are for the ability to perform a number of functions, but they shouldnt get to do EVERYTHING. I mean sheesh. take tumble, dont take spot. you dont need to have everything maxed out - and if you want to powergame like that, being bad in other areas is a decent way to balance it out.
Felnar said:
i guess i'm against the majority here
i'm all for combining some skills, and think the 2skill/level classes need a bump
but i think the rogue has enough skill points already
Most classes are skill starved because they have none. Rogues are skill starved because they think they should be great at them all.
YAY! Herehere. The rogue has enough. You shouldnt be able to have EVERYTHING at max ranks. you want to be more diverse, fine spread the points out since you have so many. you want to specialize specialize. Not every rogue needs those skills. when I make rogues (most levels in rogue), I never take disable device/open lock (to my groups horror as they never figure out I make combat rogues who are like faster swashbucklers) ( I usually take a couple levels in swashbuckler to toughen him up later and to get that int to damage)
Here's what I got. It might be longer than the ones you guys have, but I dont have the 3.5 players so I started with the expanded skill list on the 4 page character sheet. Some of these won't apply to every game.
Appraise, Autohypnosis, Agility (Balance & Tumble), Bluff, Climb, Craft, Decipher Script, Forgery, Diplomacy, Disable Device (Disable Device & Open Lock), Disguise, Escape Artist,
Gather InfoMake the PC get off their ass and use bluff/diplomacy, Handle Animal, Heal, Stealth (Hide/Move Silently), Intimidate, Jump, Know. Arcana, Know. Engineering, Know. Dungeoneering, Know. Geography, Know. History,
Know. local this one is useless if you move, and spending points in every area is ridiculous. scrap it., Know. Nature, Know. Nobility, Know. The Planes, Know. Psionics, Know. Religion, Listen, Perform (Leave all these, theyre fine), Profession: Anythign that could be a craft and a profession is just a craft. so blacksmiths dont have ranks in the profession, just the craft.
PSICraft and spellcraft use knowledge skills but need a class that can use psicraft or spellcraft for those uses., ride, search/spot (use wis to spot and int to search), sense motive, sleight of hand, survival, swim, tumble, UMD/UPD combined, Use Rope.
Thats probably about as much as I'd condense it. Actually I'd add
Pilot (Air), Pilot (Water), Navigate - We have airship campaigns and sea campaigns, so these are useful.