D&D 5E (2024) Half Race Appreciation Society: Half Elf most popular race choice in BG3

[Mistwell]

Yes.

But D&D tends to avert that problem by the word "typically". Something like.

"Drow typically exhibit a lustrous grayish complexion that can range from glossy obsidian to silverish pallor, while bluish, purplish, and other complexions are also known."

Make sure every culture includes athletic culture, intellectual culture, arts − and criminality − and I dont expect a problem.

There can be a suggestion of ethnicity without homogenizing it, because every culture will include immigrants who are now among the ancestors in the culture.

Agreed but not the topic you're responding to.

Being able to breath under water and withstand the depths of the ocean is not cultural. You saying it's learned behavior from a particular culture is weird. It's smacking of claims to cultural superiority: as if inability to breath under water and withstand the depths of the ocean sources to being raised right, and if you're an elf who cannot do those things it's your parents fault for not teaching you the cultural traditions which would have granted such abilities.

Do you see where this is leading? It's worse than using sub-species.

 

[Micah Sweet]

so you want to replace background with culture? or give everyone two backgrounds? because what background currently represents and what you're describing are not the same thing and should not be the same mechanical option IMO.

WotC can't fix this without making a change to character creation at least as significant as what Level Up did, and they won't do that due to their addiction to "simplicity".

 

[Yaarel]

Being able to breath under water and withstand the depths of the ocean is not cultural.

If members of a culture typically learn the Waterbreathing spell, then breathing under water is cultural.

Where Sea Elf is typically born with an innate Waterbreathing cantrip, that is cultural.


It is worth mentioning again, the unique situation of the Sea Elf could mean it is a multispecies community, whose ancestors are Elf and Triton.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Part of the problem is that WotC has been inconsistent with its own language and design. (Surprise!)

Prior to Tasha, the language was race and subrace. In Tasha, they used the term lineage (as in custom lineage) but kept race/subrace. Then Van Richten's introduced three "races" that had the extra benefit of being able to be gained later (dhampir, hexblood, reborn) and called those lineages too. Then MotM came as and removed subraces from aasimar, genasi, shifter, etc making some of the choices inherent to the race (aasimar celestial legacy) or making them completely different races (air genasi, fire genasi, etc). All the new subraces that were part of PHB races (deep gnome, eladrin, duergar) became full standalone races with a "counts as an X" on it's type.

Now 2024 is coming and screwing up that design by saying those former subraces (which up to this point were being treated like standalone races, or sometimes a racial feature) are called lineage, unrelated to the use of the world prior. Further, they have made it so a sea elf is a separate species that counts as an elf, but a drow is an elf lineage that is part of the main elf species. And a drow elf who becomes a dhampir is an elf with the drow lineage and the dhampir lineage over writing almost all of their species traits.

Ugh. Nasty language use. Sloppy design. Drow, high and wood elves should be standalone species like astral, eladrin, sea, and shadar-Kai. Lineage should be used to species who you can inherit after play (or is designed to overlay on other creatures) and legacy for choices in a species like the type of shifter traits or aasimar wing type. There is no consistency in the terminology, which is what helps fuel these arguments.

What I'm reading here is that Tasha's is the problem. I agree.

 

[Micah Sweet]

If members of a culture typically learn the Waterbreathing spell, then breathing under water is cultural.

Where Sea Elf is typically born with an innate Waterbreathing cantrip, that is cultural.


It is worth mentioning again, the unique situation of the Sea Elf could mean it is a multispecies community, whose ancestors are Elf and Triton.

Except, as you have been informed many, many times in this thread, cantrips and magic in general in D&D do not work like that.

 

[Mistwell]

If members of a culture typically learn the Waterbreathing spell, then breathing under water is cultural.

We established a while back how it being a spell is not workable and makes no sense. You opted to not reply at that point, but repeating it again doesn't make it more workable. Your system has children drowning, always, or else not being sea elves and living on land with their parents who also live on land as not-sea-elves. Your system has sea-elves never sleeping in, or risk drowning. Your system has their entire civilization constantly at risk of death from dispel magic, counterspell, and anti magic zones. None of this makes sense, no matter what you call sea elves. That's just not how an environmental response would work. Nobody would ever live in that environment on a permanent basis for generation after generation if it was always dependent on refreshing a spell twice daily or DIE. None of this makes sense.

 

[CreamCloud0]

If members of a culture typically learn the Waterbreathing spell, then breathing under water is cultural.

Where Sea Elf is typically born with an innate Waterbreathing cantrip, that is cultural.


It is worth mentioning again, the unique situation of the Sea Elf could mean it is a multispecies community, whose ancestors are Elf and Triton.

the point is we're making is that they shouldn't need the waterbreathing spell to breathe underwater, that's something a sea elf should just biologically be able to do, even if they were raised in a desert just because they're a sea elf, not because their parents lived on the coast and taught them how to cast water breathing.

 

[Scribe]

Where Sea Elf is typically born with an innate Waterbreathing cantrip, that is cultural.

Which, for the people at home, is literally, factually, objectively NOT the innate ability to breath water which the 2024 compatible release of the Sea Elf, has and is 'born with'.

Because its not cultural, its biological.

 

[Yaarel]

Define Culture as it pertains to this discussion of distinct entities with diverse biological traits such as flight, water breathing, super vision and heightened speed.

In the context of "biological traits", it is polymorph magic, learned and cultural.

 

[Micah Sweet]

In the context of "biological traits", it is polymorph magic, learned and cultural.

Are you just not hearing people's very legitimate objections to this? I'm honestly confused at this point.