"Half-" races

[Dannyalcatraz]

Here's a way to test the validity of that position in the real "politically correct" world: Find someone you love or respect who has parents of two different races or ethnic origins and ask that person how he or she feels about playing a "half-breed" character in D&D.

You rang?

I've been a gamer since 1977, and a person of mixed race since 1967. I call myself "Human Gumbo": I'm able to trace my origins to 5 of the 6 occupied continents, including Native American (North & South), Eastern & Western European Jews, French, German, Moroccan, Spanish, Puerto Rican, Italian, something from the British Isles, something from the far east...and that's just going back to the 1800's. In places like my home state Louisiana, I'm considered "black," but in Texas where I currenly live, I'm legally considered "Hispanic." In other places, I'd be called a "mulatto." I've been mistaken for everything from Mexican to Samoan to Turkish.

I've played Half-Elves and Half-Orcs. I do not find the term "half-breed" offensive in game. I've even used it.

Of course, I'm only one person, but that's my slant on things.

Would I support calling in-game black skinned races ni--ers?

If I were playing an American Neo-Nazi or a Southern soldier in a Civil War era game, I would- its linguisically and chronologically correct for the PCs in question.

Even Mark Twain used the term in his literature, though he wasn't a fan of the term.

Its about context and accuracy.

 

[GreatLemur]

In Don Bassingwaithe's very cool "The Dragon Below" trilogy there's a half-orc... I wanna say "rogue"... named Natrac. He has an on-again, off-again relationship with a middle-aged human woman named Bava, who lives in the capital of the Shadow Marshes. They even have a (half-orc) son together.

I think I see a problem with their math, here...

 

[Khaalis]

I won't quote what triggered this simple statement, but here it goes.

We aren't different races. We are all human, homo sapien. We are of different cultures, not different races. To even think otherwise I find more insulting than anything, especially being of multi-cultural and mutli-continental decent myself.

Edit... on another note. This has little to do with the original topic anyway.

 

[Driddle]

We aren't different races. We are all human, homo sapien. We are of different cultures, not different races. To even think otherwise I find more insulting than anything, especially being of multi-cultural and mutli-continental decent myself.

... This has little to do with the original topic anyway.

Actually, it has everything to do with the original topic and the unspoken (or in this thread, actually written) assumptions people have about other groups. The premise is the same, even if it is JUST a game. We have an opportunity to change other people's real-life attitudes by our behavior at the gaming table. We gain nothing by taking a beligerant stance under the premise of fighting political correctness.

I appreciate your comments above, that we aren't different races and that we're all human. Different cultures, yes. ... And if I may add: slightly different appearances, whether they be hair texture, skin color, eye shape or even height. ... Two people, humans, can produce a wonderful little creature that captures the essence of both parents in a wholly unique way for the next generation. It's the height of insulting idiocy to dismiss the value of that offspring as a "half-breed." So, then, why should we allow ourselves to be bigots at the gaming table when two genetically compatible imaginary people -- with different hair textures, ear shape, body size -- likewise produce a child? We might call a gaming "elf" and an "orc" a different "race," but it's obvious that in-game they can procreate. The use of the term "race" is merely a sloppy facade for describing different groups of people.

And THAT is the basis for my initial post. We (or rather, WOTC, with our prompting) have the chance to change something for the better. It costs nothing to try.

 

[blackheart5]

I appreciate your comments above, that we aren't different races and that we're all human.

Yes, this is true, but the fantasy creatures mentioned are not all human.

We might call a gaming "elf" and an "orc" a different "race," but it's obvious that in-game they can procreate. The use of the term "race" is merely a sloppy facade for describing different groups of people.

It's not obvious that all can procreate... each world decided by the GM has different reasoning on this issue. Just because something has a similiar anatomy or appearance, doesn't mean they are able to procreate. Cats and dogs are anatomical similar, but that doesn't mean they can procreate.

I may be inaccurate on this... but if I'm correct you never hear of a half-elf in Tolkien, probably due to the vast differences between the creatures. Just because one publisher twenty years ago decided they wanted to have half-humans running around everywhere, doesn't mean its plausible.

Another GM may decide that elves are truly another race... rather than a seperate species. Maybe by giving them a name like "homo elvanus" or some such. I think they should take the half races out, because I don't think they are quite standards of the industry. Hell, I've GMed some campaign worlds where a half-elf wasn't allowed due to the vast differences between human and elf.

Anyways, I know its crazy, but this is my first time on this forum. So far, great threads!

 

[Klaus]

I think I see a problem with their math, here...

Way I see it, it's a toss up if the child is born a human or a half-orc. It's not like elves, that have a math for that (50% or more elven ancestry, it's a half-elf; anything less and it's a human),

Oh and re: real world:
Please get offended by something else. There is only one human "race", and it's homo sapiens sapiens. What we have are ethnicities. And just like in real-life, the son of a blonde elf and a brunetter elf is an elf, a human is a human wether his skin is beige, chocolate or fucsia.

 

[Thurbane]

Here's a way to test the validity of that position in the real "politically correct" world: Find someone you love or respect who has parents of two different ethnic origins ("race") and ask that person how he or she feels about playing a "half-breed" character in D&D. It would be best if the person is an actual gamer already, but you could ask a similar question of a non-gamer as well. Just corner your Japanese-American friend or your African-American coworker what sort of benefits or drawbacks might be associated with a "half-breed" race, for example. Be sure to use "half-breed" a couple of times in the conversation, if you feel there's no legitimate reason you shouldn't. Carefully note the individual's emotional feedback and share details of the experience here.

Many people use the term "politically correct" as a backhanded way of discounting basic respect and consideration for other people. There's nothing "politically correct" about being a decent person and avoiding offensive terms. Even in games.

You've swayed me sir...now I also think that "bastard" swords should be renamed "hand-and-a-half" swords so as not to offend the children of unmarried couples. Fairies should also be renamed, so as not to potentially offend gay people.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

I may be inaccurate on this... but if I'm correct you never hear of a half-elf in Tolkien..

Actually, I believe Elrond himself is referred to as "Half-Elven".

And there's definitely reference to Half-Orcs in Tolkien's work, too.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

You want to go one step further and give them some mechanical difference? Fine. Come up with a feat or two for the representative common half types like half-elves. Adding templates for every half race that is out there and trying to figure out who can breed with what? No thanks.

Er... I was going to run a search but apparently the search option isn't working for me today


Anyway, there is a thread buried in the HR forum that does start taking this step. The basic concept is:

Humankind is thin blooded and able to interbreed with other races. This fact also makes them immune to the effects of Bane weapons, as that enhancement must target a true blooded race such as Elf or Dwarf.

At first level a character may sacrifice thier bonus skill point and take a Blooded feat that grants them some of the racial abliities of another race. This makes them a 'Half-X' breed and vulnerable to Bane weapons that target that races blood. These Blooded feats are often more powerful than a normal feat.

[of to Meta to find out what the problem is with my account ]

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

We aren't different races.

Technically, "race" is a vague term without grounding in biology. It is purely a broad tent of a term covering ethnicities, cultures, and sociological factors. It can, however, point at certain tightly grouped, isolated populations.

So, yes, we are different races...but read on.

We are all human, homo sapien.

This is 100% accurate. As far as science knows, there is only one human species still living on the face of the Earth, and we are it.

We are of different cultures, not different races. To even think otherwise I find more insulting than anything, especially being of multi-cultural and mutli-continental decent myself.

Personally, I find no inherent insult in distinction between races. The insult comes when it is consciously injected into the discussion.