Halving Hitpoints

[Jack Colby]

Since this problem seems to be happening across the board, has WotC ever commented officially on it? Have the designers commented in blogs? It seems like they poorly playtested the game, if everyone is having a problem with fights dragging due to too many HP.

 

[keterys]

Errm, I haven't had a problem with fights dragging due to too many hit points at all. I've only really played levels 1 through 12, though - maybe it's worse at epic tier. Maybe it's worse if you never have a striker and/or have lower damage builds (like Cha paladins instead of great weapon fighters)

In the sessions I've played (mostly low level), usually one striker (I think two sessions with two). In the games I DM, there's 2 strikers in two groups and 1 striker in the other group. No rangers, though. Warlock in each group. Not a lot of low damage builds, though - wizards closest thing in two of the three groups, but couple fighters, dwarven melee clerics - warlords who do okay damage and can give someone who does more damage a leg up.

 

[Old Gumphrey]

You guys know you can force a bloodied target to surrender with an Intimidate check, right?

 

[keterys]

Yep. Hasn't come up much yet, though - I did it once, but the DM didn't even make me roll under that circumstance (I guess it was written into the module to trigger at a certain point). It's a standard action and the DC is fairly high and it works best if you've got more than one person bloodied. And, I mean, as a dragonborn inspiring warlord, I really thought I'd have more opportunities.

Maybe after more sessions I will.

 

[Old Gumphrey]

I always love the "but it's a Standard action" complaint. As if getting someone to surrender is some minor bonus. It's not like feinting in combat. =)

You can also use Aid Another on this check. The group I DM for used this technique on a very hard fight they triggered through multiple failed skill challenges and blatant stupidity. They barely brought the elite boss down to half hit points, then used Wall of Fog, two sets of Ghost Sound, and three successful Aids on an Intimidate check to get it to work, and it did.

We've also seen someone force an elite to surrender by themselves. It's not impossible, or even unlikely. I just always chuckle when there's an option this good and people want to spend time reworking the entire combat system because they'd rather not do anything besides make attack rolls.

 

[keterys]

It's a very good option - it's why I've got a +12 at 2nd level. It's not optimized, but it is pretty darn good.

Normal monsters tend to go from bloodied to dead in a round, limiting the usefulness of Intimidate.

Elite monsters in theory will tend to have around Level + 13 Will and get a +10 on that for hostility, so at 2nd level that's DC 25 with +12 - which is a solid chance. If the target doesn't understand my language, need a 18.

Of course, that's assuming the creature will surrender at all. Enough DMs won't. Or make it a penalty somehow (perhaps out of spite)

And that's a frustration that's worth avoiding except when it's valuable. So, the standard action, the high DCs, and having to deal with repurcussions makes it a sometime option.