Harassment At PaizoCon 2017

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In our post-Harvey Weinstein world, more and more people in the various entertainment industries are coming forward with allegations of abuse and harassment, both sexual and psychological. The tabletop gaming industry isn't isolated from this wave of revelation as incidents surface, and will likely continue to surface about professionals, and fans, within the gaming communities.


Stories of harassment within tabletop gaming, at conventions and stores, and even in local gaming groups are nothing new. That is probably the saddest fact of this whole thing: that despite stories being brought to light, not only does harassment continue to happen but the existence of it continues to be denied by some. This denial is one of the factors that allows abuse and harassment to continue within tabletop RPGs.

Allegations of improper behavior at the 2017 PaizoCon by Frog God Games CEO Bill Webb were brought to life by Pathfinder content creator Robert Brookes. Brookes was attending PaizoCon and has written for Paizo and Legendary Games, among others. In an incident involving alcohol, Webb allegedly sexually harassed another guest at the convention and when a staffer attempted to intervene and injury occurred with the staffer.

In a thread about harassment and abuse on gaming forum RPGNet, Frog God Games partner Matt Finch, creator of the Swords & Wizardry retroclone, confirmed that the incident with Webb occurred, and revealed some details about an internal investigation that the partners of Frog God Games conducted into the incident:

"I am Matt Finch, the partner of Frog God Games appointed by the partners to investigate a sexual harassment complaint filed against Mr. Webb at PaizoCon 2017. Mr. Webb was not consulted by the partners on this decision. Due to recent accusations made on Twitter by a third party, I will outline the aspects of the situation to the extent that they do not compromise the confidentiality of the person who filed the report, I will describe the nature of our internal investigation, and will also address the recently-raised tweets by Robert Brookes on his twitter feed. This report will not necessarily be updated; it stands for itself at the time of posting, based on the knowledge I currently have.

"First, it is correct that a complaint was filed with Paizo at PaizoCon against Bill. I was made aware of this by phone on the day it happened (I was not present at the convention). Frog God is aware of the identity of the person who made the complaint, because they spoke to three of our partners at the convention after the event. We have not been invited to share that person’s identity, and although we are not under legal obligation to protect that confidentiality we have elected to respect that person’s desire not to have the event brought into the spotlight.

"Gathering information in a situation like this is necessarily limited due to Paizo’s own confidentiality obligations. To assemble information, I spoke to the three partners who had talked with the person who filed the complaint, and obtained their accounts of what they were told. Secondhand accounts are not perfect, and I had to weigh that against the fact that an attorney making direct contact with someone who has filed such a report can be seen as a threat or intimidation, and weighing those two issues, I chose to rely on a comparison of the conversations between the individual and our partners, plus Paizo’s own resolution of the matter at the time, plus a necessarily-cautious review of Bill’s account. There has been contact between the person who filed the complaint and Frog God partners since the event, and I will provide a screenshot of one such communication with the name redacted. I believe the screenshot provides a great deal of clarification.

"Reducing the event to a level that will maintain confidentiality, my understanding based on my investigation was that Bill Webb took an action and engaged in speech that could be construed as a sexual advance or as gender-dismissive.

"In consequence of this finding, I and another senior partner of the company had a meeting with Mr. Webb about expectations, standards of behavior, and future protocol. We addressed that one’s lack of bad intentions does not excuse problematic behavior.

"Some people have asked that Mr. Webb acknowledge and apologize for the situation. Bill does deeply regret his actions, and understands that they were inappropriate and upsetting. I have told Mr. Webb not to contact the person directly, for the same reason that I have not done so myself: the potential for that contact to appear intimidating or threatening. However, at whatever time the person lets us know that a direct apology from Mr. Webb would be welcomed, that apology will be immediately forthcoming. Mr. Webb is also under instruction not to discuss this matter in public, in case peripheral details were to be inadvertently disclosed that might allow the identification of the person by another party. This is also the reason we chose to have me, as the investigating partner, write the public report, given that a report has become necessary in response to a recent description of the event on Twitter."


We reached out to Webb for comment upon this incident, and we were directed to the RPGNet post by Finch. This is the company's official statement on what happened at PaizoCon. Whether or not there will be further repercussions within Frog God Games due to this incident and Webb's actions remain to be seen.

Paizo CEO Lisa Stevens has released an official statement on the incident on the Paizo forums. When EN World reached out to Paizo for official comment, we were directed to this statement:

"My name is Lisa Stevens and I am the CEO and owner of Paizo Inc. Events of the past few weeks have compelled me to make this statement.

"My company will never condone any sexual harassment or assault against any of our employees, male or female. We will never condone any sexual harassment or assault against any of our customers on paizo.com or at sanctioned organized play activities. Whenever I hear any allegations of sexual harassment or assault related to Paizo’s activities, I always immediately drop whatever I'm doing and I make getting to the bottom of these issues my top priority. We have banned people from paizo.com. We have banned people from participating in our organized play activities. We have stopped doing business with individuals. And we will continue to do so.
"As a woman and a survivor of sexual harassment, sexual assault, and rape, I know what it is like to be on the receiving end of these attacks. I know what it is like to feel the shame, the terror, how it changes your life forever. And because of this, I will never stand for my company to condone this behavior.

"Paizo’s employees are encouraged to come forward with any allegations of sexual harassment or assault and let a manager know as soon as possible. If criminal activities have taken place, they are encouraged to report it to the police and take legal action against the perpetrator. We have asked our employees to not engage in explosive and angry dialogue on paizo.com. We want our website to be a place where our customers feel safe and among friends. If there is problem on paizo.com, then our community team will handle it and, where appropriate, ban the perpetrator.

"In closing, you have my word that I have zero tolerance for sexual harassment and assault, and the same is true of Paizo. Please be aware that we treat these issues with tremendous sensitivity, and only disclose the specifics and resolutions of any such incidents on a need-to-know basis, even within Paizo or with our legal counsel. We do not and will not discuss these matters publicly. Every instance that I am aware of has been thoroughly investigated, and appropriate actions have been taken or are in the process of being taken. You have my word on this."


Unrelated to the PaizoCon incident, Brookes also revealed an incident of harassment within the Pathfinder Society organized play program. When a volunteer staffer reported this incident, their supervisor informed them that an NDA they had signed to be part of the program would not allow her to discuss this incident. Paizo has not officially commented on this incident or commented on whether or not there is an investigation into it.

If tabletop role-playing games are truly going to be an inclusive, we have to be better about not just reporting incidents of abuse and harassment but being dedicated to creating spaces that are safe and free of harassment of our fellow gamers. We also need to shine a spotlight onto the incidents of harassment that occur, it is the responsibility of journalists, bloggers and gamers to do this and let people know that their actions will come to light and that they will be held responsible. It is also important to not just talk about those parts of the gaming communities that we don't agree with, but to also bring to light the improper actions of those companies and communities with whom we do agree, because unless every act of harassment is revealed there will be no change within our communities.

Remember that EN World is an inclusive community.
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Olaf the Stout

Adventurer
As the author of the material in question let me just state that while I did not create Folca originally (I don't know who on staff created them to add to the appendix in the back of BotD 3 which I wrote the entirety of) I was contracted the write the flavor text for all of the daemonic harbingers. Given the original plausible subtext for Folca it was not the most pleasant thing to write, but I didn't have the option to just not write something on my outline so I tried to present something that was hideous and evil. I would not personally use Folca or their followers directly in a game, outside of them existing like a boogieman to drive home the absolute horror of Abaddon as a plane. I would never explicitly describe anything by Folca in a game, rather just let that particular monster stay in the dark and let the players' brains fill in the hideous specifics.

I can't comment on the mechanical aspects of the entry for Folca as the content changed during development and out of professional tact I'm not comfortable getting into a discussion about specific developer changes versus turnover. I apologize for any offense at the material. Please don't insinuate damaging and ludicrous things about anyone that wrote or developed the material.
The one thing I can suggest for future situations like this is that it is ok to say, "No" or to question the person that contracted you as to whether this sort of thing should be included.

Yes, doing something like that is often hard, I'm not suggesting that it isn't, but it takes courage to do the right thing sometimes.
 

Olaf the Stout

Adventurer
As the developer of the Book of the Damned, I can indeed confirm Folca was an error of judgement.

If I had a time machine I'd go back and just cut Folca from the book entirely, since the inclusion of an entity that mirorred something like Pennywise from "It" obviously missed the mark HARD. (I wasn't involved in the initial creation of Folca back in the softcover Book of the Damned 3, but that's irrelevant to the fact that he's in the hardcover version. That inclusion, an error, is on me.)

It's something I would do differently now. Book of the Damned is indeed intended to be about evil, but that doesn't mean having ALL evils represented in it is a good thing. There's a lot of content that I took specific steps to deliberately NOT include in the book, and in hindsight this one should have been left on the cutting room floor as well.

I apologize for it, for what's that worth, and am grateful for the fact that I've been given this chance to learn from the mistake going forward in my role as Pathfinder's Creative Director.
So, given that you feel the Folca should be cut from the book, has the PDF at least been edited to remove the Folca from the book? If it's something that you and Paizo feel is an error then you should be going back and doing what you can to correct the error.

Amending the PDF doesn't mean that the Folca won't exist in the hard copies, or in the PDF copies already out there, but it is something totally within Paizo's control to correct.
 

Libramarian

Villager
Ok. I read that. I’m still not seeing a description of what occurred. It leaves way to much to my interpretation. What was going on that Robert had to drag Bill Webb off of this person? Why weren’t the police notified? I’m just confused about what actually happened. I understand it was harassment and clearly upsetting but that is still a huge spectrum of possible behaviors.
I can't find a clear description of what happened either. Refusing to describe the sexual harassment in detail to protect the victim makes some sense, but I can't see why they're being so vague about what sort of injury the person who intervened suffered. It's interesting that Matt Finch of FGG makes no mention of Webb attacking anyone physically. Neither does the victim. The only person making that claim AFAICT is Brookes.
 

James Jacobs

Explorer
The question of what to do with Folca going forward is a no-brainer—we won't be using him in Pathfinder content, and I'll ABSOLUTELY be using the lessons I've learned as well in striving to not repeat the mistake.

But it's unfortunately not so simple to just "cut" Folca from the book, since that would be a not-insignificant process of cutting the daemon harbinger's entry from the text and the compiled table and removing the artwork, since he wouldn't be in the book anymore. (We don't have a good piece of replacement art for this part of the book, alas, and adding a 3rd of a page of new words to fill up the missing space would further complicate things...)

Another option would be to KEEP the artwork and just completely rewrite Folca to be a different type of daemon entirely and swerve his themes completely away from anything to do with child abuse. Folca could just as easily be a daemon associated with poisoning food, for example, and the treat he's holding in his illustration becomes a sneaky attempt to poison someone. But that doesn't change the fact that the imagery of a creepy thing holding out a piece of candy evokes VERY specific reactions and imagery. Would simply rewriting him be enough? I don't know, and I'd love folks to shoot me an email at james dot jacobs at paizo dot com with their thoughts on that.

Anyway... as I've said above it's a complicated thing that will take time for us to fix if we decide to go that route. But it's also a very IMPORTANT thing to look into. I'll be talking with Erik ASAP about the potential of adjusting the PDF version of the book, in any event. The final decision to do so is not mine to make so I can't make promises about this, but I'm gonna be doing what I can to make it right.
 

Atlictoatl

Villager
Would simply rewriting him be enough?
Looking at a table of daemonic harbingers and seeing one entry with spheres of influence over child abuse would certainly stand out to me. It's difficult for me to assess to what degree that would be so without examining the rest of the entries for context. Note that it absolutely will be triggering for certain individuals, though by publishing a list of daemonic harbingers and their spheres of influence, you're essentially publishing a list of triggers and are presumably okay with that.

Expanding beyond an entry in a table to a description of the daemon, of its activity, of the activity of its worshippers, etc. is traveling much further along the spectrum of questionable taste. Surely, a prospective GM or player who saw the table entry and wanted to expound on Folca for their game would be best left to their own devices in doing so, yes? Does Paizo really want to be in the business of instructing their audience how specifically to portray child abusers? Still, you or others may feel it has some value to a prospective group that intends to focus on fighting such elements.

Including a visual depiction goes a step further, cementing a specific construct with visual imagery. If it's good art, it'll be designed to be disturbing and to imprint itself on the reader. Does Paizo want to be in the business of the visual depiction of child abuse or molestation?

It's conceivable that the above might be defensible, though you'd be pretty far along the tightrope in doing so.

Publishing mechanics whose only utility is to simulate sexual abuse is so far across the line that it's simply indefensible. There is no reason to ever publish something like that. If players or GMs wish to simulate sexual abuse in their games, let them come up with their own mechanics for it. IMO, no right-minded gaming company would ever want to be associated with that.

At a bare minimum, if it's within your means to remove content already published, you should absolutely excise the mechanics that are explicitly for sexual abuse. There's just no good reason for those to exist.

Please note that I am not a survivor of abuse and it hasn't touched me directly, so my tolerance for this topic and my ability to remain non-triggered will be higher than those who do have direct experience. Their opinion may not be as lenient as the one I've expressed here.
 
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fantasmamore

Villager
Somehow his book "Bill Webb's Book of Dirty Tricks" seems a little bit frightening right now.

On another note, how is it that if I say that a burglar got into my house the first thing people ask is "Are you ok?" and if a woman says that she's been sexually harassed the first thing people say is "Prove it!"?
Nobody should feel unsafe or threatened or just uncomfortable for whatever reason. The person that makes other people feel this way should be punished. And I don't mean only the law. We are consumers, clients, customers, whatever, we have the power to make a choice.

And since I probably missed it, where is Mr Dirty Tricks' public apology?
 
The continued focus on "we don't know the details" by some posters in this thread is emblematic of the ongoing problem in our community and society in general. It says, very starkly, that these sorts of things don't happen to "good girls"
If you refer to my post "one post earlier" in no way did I imply any such accusations on the victim or not even did such a thought cross my mind. I only said *I* am not in a position to judge anyone regarding an event where I am not present. Others (including the victim for example) obviously are in a position to judge here.

The reason for my post was a different one: I am firmly of an opinion that I can be a judge if drinking much alcohol while representing your company is "normal" or "okay" or sounds fishy (the last one is correct, the other two NOT). In some posts in this thread the Alcohol was used as an "Excuse". This does not work. If anything it makes it even worse (at least in my worldview). I like an eveningbeer or whatever myselves, but while officially representing your company? Really? And so much that you are described as "drunk" by other people?
 

Eltab

Villager
Would simply rewriting (Folca) be enough?
You might find inspiration by reading through 3e Heroes of Horror. It includes essays on how to handle nasty subject matter without grossing out the rest of the table.
The artwork I remember from it was a hag-ish being with a bunch of children around the table, eating a bit cut from one child's arm. Those of us who are natural Paladins instantly understood who needed a Shield and who needed a Smiting.

As I've indicated in another conversation within this thread, using 'reaction shots' and third-party descriptions of a horrible act, rather than details of the horrible act front-and-center, can set a mood and engage the players' imagination. The players will motivate themselves to take care of the Evil.
 

Demmero

Villager
I can't find a clear description of what happened either. Refusing to describe the sexual harassment in detail to protect the victim makes some sense, but I can't see why they're being so vague about what sort of injury the person who intervened suffered. It's interesting that Matt Finch of FGG makes no mention of Webb attacking anyone physically. Neither does the victim. The only person making that claim AFAICT is Brookes.
It's likewise interesting that someone at FGG chose to label the post addressing the sexual harassment at a convention as "Response from Frog God Games to events on social media." Talk about misleading: It makes it sound like the incident itself happened on social media...just another internet spat.

The actual post itself gets straight to the point about the allegations...provided the viewer actually bothers to click on the title link, that is.

http://www.talesofthefroggod.com/forum/response-frog-god-games-events-social-media
 

GMSkarka

Villager
Go back and re-read Post Number One.

It was a better description than the material we had to work with when I was on Jury Duty.
Exactly. At this point "I can't find a clear description of what happened", or "I haven't seen documentation", is a clear red-flag for somebody looking to engage in real-world rules lawyering, for whom none of the extensive details will EVER be enough.

Same thing is happening with the Mentzer issue.
 

BookBarbarian

Expert Long Rester
On another note, how is it that if I say that a burglar got into my house the first thing people ask is "Are you ok?" and if a woman says that she's been sexually harassed the first thing people say is "Prove it!"?
This is an elegant statement of a big problem. A big problem that stops victims of harassment and abuse from coming forward.
 

Libramarian

Villager
Go back and re-read Post Number One.

It was a better description than the material we had to work with when I was on Jury Duty.
So this?

"Reducing the event to a level that will maintain confidentiality, my understanding based on my investigation was that Bill Webb took an action and engaged in speech that could be construed as a sexual advance or as gender-dismissive."

That's better than what you had to work with when you were on jury duty?

Matt Finch also says this later in his statement, which as @Alzrius pointed out earlier seems to have been intentionally omitted by @Christopher Helton in his article:

"A series of tweets brought to our attention have mentioned that an altercation occurred at the time of the incident, and that a Paizo employee was injured. From talking to the individual who made the complaint we have not been made aware of any altercation beyond the behavior of Mr. Webb addressed in the complaint."

So he doesn't think anyone was attacked and injured. Finch also originally posted a screenshot of FGG's conversation with the person who made the harassment complaint, saying:

"In terms of the affected person’s own view on the matter, and as a lead-in to a discussion of the recent tweets, we believe that the following communication will give third parties a better understanding of the context of the event...."​

But the screenshot is now deleted. In the RPG.net thread he explains,

"Edit: the person who filed the complaint has called me to talk about the event, which was a very productive call. They did say that they would prefer I not keep up the image that was posted here, so I've taken it down."

There is a serious disagreement here between Finch/FGG's investigation and Brookes' account on Twitter. I hope the victim isn't feeling pressured by the Brookes side to keep quiet about what happened lest her account belie theirs.
 

Libramarian

Villager
On another note, how is it that if I say that a burglar got into my house the first thing people ask is "Are you ok?" and if a woman says that she's been sexually harassed the first thing people say is "Prove it!"?
Not an appropriate analogy for the current situation. Firstly because the victim here is not the one publicizing their harassment. She actually has stated that she considers the matter closed and would prefer if everyone stopped talking about it. So it's more like your neighbor on the left is making a lot of noise about your neighbor on the right burgling the home of your neighbor across the street, and their account is much more sensationalistic ("and they killed their dog!") than that of the person whose home was actually broken into.
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
I hope the victim isn't feeling pressured by the Brookes side to keep quiet about what happened lest her account belie theirs.
That's bloody ridiculous. No, the victim (who many people know - it's not some anonymous person) is not being pressured by Brookes to keep quiet. You know people can read this, right? It's your outside voice.
 
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So here is my understanding of this lengthy thread-

1) Bill Webb harassed someone at Paizocon. Behavior that is unacceptable and should never be tolerated. While I understand the reason the police were not called I believe that was a serious mistake. Behavior should have consequences and this is a natural consequence. Maybe he would have been arrested maybe not. But this would have been the most direct and natural consequence for his behavior.
2) Someone may or may not have been physically injured
3) FGG games acknowledged his behavior but any real consequences are unclear. Since he is the founder/partner it is also unclear what recourse the other partners would have.
4) Based on many accounts he needs intervention for his drinking and behavior that sounds routinely poor at such events.

Having bought FGG products in the past I am not sure what I think about future support. It is a complicated picture considering contractors and many variables I don't know. But it would help me feel more at ease, if a more aggressive statement followed by some sort of sanctions by FGG was issued but I am not sure the actual authority of the other partners. Looking at their current KS though, there is no mention of this in the comments which makes me believe most of their backers are unaware or unconcerned.
 

the_redbeard

Explorer
Not an appropriate analogy for the current situation. Firstly because the victim here is not the one publicizing their harassment. She actually has stated that she considers the matter closed and would prefer if everyone stopped talking about it. So it's more like your neighbor on the left is making a lot of noise about your neighbor on the right burgling the home of your neighbor across the street, and their account is much more sensationalistic ("and they killed their dog!") than that of the person whose home was actually broken into.
Since so many people can't seem to find it (even though it is on the first page of comments), I'm posting below the already posted testimony of the affected individual.

Note that she is speaking out because of the treatment by the doubters towards the people who helped her. I'm glad she's able to move on and is still a part of the hobby and industry.

To me the issue is whether Bill Webb will come clean and take responsibility for his behavior and whether conventions will continue to allow his presence if he does not change his ways. I've communicated my feelings with FGG folks. Some of the partners are reportedly out of the country so they are currently unable to formulate more of a response than they have.

BJ Hensley post on Paizo, regarding the incident
"Paizo Con: The only thing I desire is peace and to be left alone to create.

As the victim in this particular situation, I have watched in public silence as the world dissected my story and speculated as to the intimate details. I looked on and relived these events as people believed, disbelieved, defended me passionately, and cast doubt on the situation. I received many wonderful messages from those who were there or heard what happened, expressions of anger on my behalf and an outpouring of love. And yet I am heartbroken by what I see, not due to the event itself but that these same individuals, who aided me when I was in need, are being verbally assaulted and accused of less than exemplary behavior. So, despite being told that I in no way needed to by countless individuals on all sides of the event, I’ve chosen to speak. I’ve selected Paizo as my medium to do so to ensure that everyone can see my words.

What happened at Paizo Con was not appropriate. The offensive behavior I dealt with from this person was very inappropriate, unwanted, and frankly a bit scary. However, Paizo’s staff did all they could to ensure I was safe, they made all the right offers to take care of the situation, and when I declined some of their suggestions they chose to protect me with their silence. Nearly every member of Paizo’s staff interacted with me in some way during these awful events. Many offered protection, others walked me to my room, spoke out on my behalf, held my hand while I was afraid, and even physically stepped in when the clearly inebriated individual in no way wanted to hear my “No thank you.”. In the end, Lisa Stevens herself shed tears alongside me as she heard my story. Her concern was genuine, her anger fierce, and at no point was there any disbelief. She passionately argued to be able to defend me and doesn’t deserve to be accused of doing anything less than her very best to protect me while I was in her “house”. Paizo made me feel welcome, believed in, and defended me in every way I would allow.

No one tried to silence me, I silenced them.

The individual who stalked me through the halls that day was far too drunk to drive, he had children staying at the convention, and I asked that he be allowed to leave when sober. I also requested the incident be kept as quiet as possible to protect his family. Additionally, several of my friends work at the very company this man represents, I didn’t want their professional lives impacted by a public scandal any more than I wanted anyone else’s to be. Members of Frog God Games checked in on me and handled their side of the mess as they saw fit. I protected others and I tried to protect myself. I’m a private person who’s survived far worse storms than what happened here and I simply wanted to resolve the issue for all involved and put it behind me before it resurfaced more traumatic events in my mind. We all have to choose what hills we die on. I didn't feel the need to make this one mine. I work here. This industry is my life, it’s where my friends are, it’s my creative outlet; the place where I bring to life all the crazy ideas parading through my mind, and all I want to do is take my imagination out for a stroll and create games we all enjoy.

I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to all the people who cared enough to stand up for me, walk beside me, and protect me from the public. I personally consider this matter closed and would prefer everyone else do so as well for the sake of my own privacy and personal sanity. – BJ Hensley"

From here: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2uoph?Open-Letter-From-Paizo-CEO-Lisa-Stevens
 

Libramarian

Villager
That's bloody ridiculous. No, the victim (who many people know - it's not some anonymous person) is not being pressured by Brookes to keep quiet. You know people can read this, right? It's your outside voice.
I said feeling pressured. Perhaps just by the thought of how embarrassing it would be for him if she were to come out now and say his account isn't accurate.

Since so many people can't seem to find it (even though it is on the first page of comments), I'm posting below the already posted testimony of the affected individual.

Note that she is speaking out because of the treatment by the doubters towards the people who helped her. I'm glad she's able to move on and is still a part of the hobby and industry.
I read that. She seems to be writing primarily to defend Paizo and their handling of the situation. It's interesting she doesn't thank or defend Brookes.
 

evilref

Villager
It's interesting how you keep trying to not so subtly defend Bill Webb and raise questions and doubts about the witnesses and victims who've come forwards.

I do hope you're not being pressured into it.

/s
 

Olaf the Stout

Adventurer
I said feeling pressured. Perhaps just by the thought of how embarrassing it would be for him if she were to come out now and say his account isn't accurate.



I read that. She seems to be writing primarily to defend Paizo and their handling of the situation. It's interesting she doesn't thank or defend Brookes.
You could look at it the other way. She has not said that anything Brookes has claimed has been incorrect. Interesting how she doesn't call him out, or suggest that he's a liar.

Funny how you can flip it 180 degrees, without any factual evidence either way, to support whatever argument you wish to make.
 
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