Have you played BRP Call of Cthulhu?

[Thanee]

The only conclusion that I can come to about people who tout this canard is that they came to this decision before they even opened the cover.

The biggest gripes I have with D20 CoC is levels, hit points and such.

Characters start out fairly low and increase drastically in skill during a campaign. Hit points (even with the lower massive damage rule) make certain, that a person can survive much more than he or she should. All that doesn't fit with my mental image of CoC.

BRP certainly has its faults as well and in general I would rate the D20 system quite a bit higher. But it catches the spirit of Cthulhu gaming much better IMHO.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Henry]

The thread is for your comments: How did you like the game? Why did you dislike it? Have you played a campaign, or just one-shots? Have you played under GM/Keepers who ensured wholesale slaughter? ...or let the chips fall as they may? Anyone played BtMOM?

Extra for experts: If you've played BRP and D20 Call of Cthulhu, which do you like better, and why? (I have never played D20 CoC, so you may enlighten me on its merits if you wish!)

Played both, played MORE BRP than d20 version!

I liked the BRP version for several reasons, but mostly because it felt like I was playing or DM'ing a "commoners" game of D&D - if you want the closest thing you can get to realism without a system loaded with charts and tables, you'll buy the BRP version. It's useful for more than just horror; it's useful for any "hard realism" genre, whether you want to play historical tales of the wild west or a military platoon style game. I used to BE a GM known for his wholesale slaughter but the main reason people stopped playing the system where I am is because it was just TOO DAMNED DEPRESSING for long-term play. For one-shots it rules.

That said, while I like BRP more, I think d20 is the better game, because though it is still decidedly lethal, players still feel like they're making progress. It keeps them playing, and that alone is a good thing. Where I can't get two BRP players together, I can get a dozen d20 players, even though combat is still as gruesome as it ever was.

 

[Psion]

The biggest gripes I have with D20 CoC is levels, hit points and such.

Characters start out fairly low and increase drastically in skill during a campaign. Hit points (even with the lower massive damage rule) make certain, that a person can survive much more than he or she should.

I find your statement contratictory. In one breath you say you recognize the existence of the MDT, and then you say it makes it certain you can survive more than you should. There is no such certainty. You could die at any time.

It's sort of difficult to suggest that's not a major deviation from D&D.

As for skills, how would you know? Lovecraft didn't write trilogies. He wrote novellas and short stories. If you are even making a comparison between the two based on their rate of advancement, you are hosed out of the starting gate.

All that doesn't fit with my mental image of CoC.

I strongly suspect that "mental image" is based on the game itself vice the works of Lovecraft. If that's your definition, it's sort of hard to make a game more like itself feel than itself.

At any rate, I was not so much disputing a matter of preferences; I feel both systems have their strengths and weaknesses. If BRP is what you are comfortable with, then I have no reason to disuade you from that. Rather, I was disputing your assertion that d20 will always feel like D&D. That fails to recognize drastic changes that can be and are made to other d20 games.

 

[Thanee]

I find your statement contratictory. In one breath you say you recognize the existence of the MDT, and then you say it makes it certain you can survive more than you should. There is no such certainty. You could die at any time.

I meant it more like "despite the MDT rule", which is meant to induce that sort of realistic deadliness.

Hit points still allow characters to get going after a considerable amount of punishment on a regular basis.

It's sort of difficult to suggest that's not a major deviation from D&D.

It certainly is. Just not enough for my tastes.

As for skills, how would you know?

It's not realistic to me, that's all. You don't start out with almost no knowledge and after a couple months can rival any professor in your field of expertise. This takes years upon years and this learning curve is more realistically modelled in BRP (start out pretty high, increase at a low rate) compared to D20 (start out very low, increase at a high rate).

I strongly suspect that "mental image" is based on the game itself vice the works of Lovecraft. If that's your definition, it's sort of hard to make a game more like itself feel than itself.

Heh. The mental image I am speaking of just is more realistic than what the D20 system offers.

D20 almost automatically leads to some sort of "comic book" approach, which is hardly appropriate here.

At any rate, I was not so much disputing a matter of preferences; I feel both systems have their strengths and weaknesses. If BRP is what you are comfortable with, then I have no reason to disuade you from that. Rather, I was disputing your assertion that d20 will always feel like D&D. That fails to recognize drastic changes that can be and are made to other d20 games.

"feels like D&D" doesn't mean it's equal to D&D. Just that some elements are so similar still, while others surely aren't, that a certain D&D-feel will always be present, and that's the part about heroic versus realism. This works great for D&D or Star Wars or any other heroic game, but not so much for Call of Cthulhu (IMHO of course).

As I said, once you take away those elements, it isn't D20 anymore.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Olive]

As I said, once you take away those elements, it isn't D20 anymore.

I more or less completely disagree with your assesment. the 10pt MDR means that even if you had 500hp, you could die at any time. You won't get better at hititng nearly as fast as you would if you were maxing out skill points in the BRP version, and if you don't like the rate of advancement, then halve the xp awards.

But the idea that d20 is cinematic per se is absurd. I'm sure that most midnight players would disagree.