Healing Hands + Devoted Paladin = uber healing?

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Add Hospitaler for triple Cha at Paragon.

Not sure if I want this for my Kalashatar paladin again or not... I traded Healing Hands for Virtuous Recovery last level under the assumption that it would prevent more damage than this heals most days.

Yep, I noticed this one when I created a Halfling Paladin with the Mark of Healing.

I don't know if it's overpowered. It might be "overfocused". I would also suggest the Cleric multiclass feat that grants you Healers Lore. (Interestingly, the Character Builder in the current version allows taking multiple multiclass feats from the same class, but does add the house rule note? How can that be?)

I mean, generally, you might get benefits from Charisma from different powers and special abilities, but they would go to different effects. Maybe you get an ability that allows you to add Charisma to Lay on Hands Healing, an abilty that allows you to add Charisma to damage once per encounter, and an ability that allows you to add Charisma to a defense once per encounter..

Would this be overpowered, too, because you find a way to milk your Charisma Bonus from multiple sources?

Of course, it is reminiscent of various special abilities in 3E that allowed to add "non-standard" ability scores to Armor Class. But this was usually problematic due to the frontloadedness of the given classes - it grants you lots of good features at 1st level to make the character concept behind the class work, but if you multiclass, you get more out of it then intended.

But in this case, you take discrete abilities - feats, powers or paragon paths that you can't "cherry pick" from an entire suite of abilities that is normally linked together but through your "trick" is not. Multiclass feats are designed to give you specific abilities and stay balanced. Paragon Paths can't be cherry picked - pick all or pick nothing. Normal Feats are all assumed to be fair game once you qualify for them, and the power boost gained by them shouldn't break anything.

So, I think it's not a problem of overpowered abilities. It is a problem of "overfocusing". But that doesn't have to mean it's too powerful. You gain in one area, but don't get the opportunity to gain in another one. Your Lay on Hands really counts for a lot now, but your Divine Challenge might not count as much.

 

[Destil]

(Interestingly, the Character Builder in the current version allows taking multiple multiclass feats from the same class, but does add the house rule note? How can that be?)

Known bug last time I looked on the CB forums.

 

[cstyln]

Its ok, but remmember that Healing Hands specifically states "ally", where LoH can be used on self too.

So your saying that one can be an enemy of oneself? I always thought of myself as an ally since i do what i can to take care of myself.

 

[DracoSuave]

You are not an ally because the book says you are not your own ally.

 

[Mort_Q]

Players's Handbook, page 57, under TARGET.

 

[DracoSuave]

I don't know if it's overpowered. It might be "overfocused". I would also suggest the Cleric multiclass feat that grants you Healers Lore.

Cause of all the cleric powers that paladin list avails you....

 

[cstyln]

You are not an ally because the book says you are not your own ally.

Well you are correct, my mistake.


Imo though, what a dumb concept. Kinda makes the feats for improving LOH even more watered down. I may have to HR that one for the sake of not completely making the paladin slit his own wrist and re-rolling. I mean seriously, any educated person will tell you that you cannot help someone effectively if you cannot help yourself. It's not being selfish, it's just logic.

 

[DracoSuave]

Imo though, what a dumb concept.

It's to prevent a leader class from self-buffing himself into making the other party members obsolete, for one. There's other reasons as well, some thematic, some otherwise.

So, consider it part game balance, and part flavor.

Yeah, I know, it's logical that a warrior based on self-sacrifice for the greater order as befits his god would logically have abilities that work better on himself than others...

...okay, wait, maybe it isn't logical.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Cause of all the cleric powers that paladin list avails you....

Yeah, I reread the ability and noticed it is limited to Cleric powers. Only interesting if you get a lot of Cleric powers with healing by multiclassing.

 

[cstyln]

It's to prevent a leader class from self-buffing himself into making the other party members obsolete, for one. There's other reasons as well, some thematic, some otherwise.

So, consider it part game balance, and part flavor.

Yeah, I know, it's logical that a warrior based on self-sacrifice for the greater order as befits his god would logically have abilities that work better on himself than others...

...okay, wait, maybe it isn't logical.

LOL, nice backhanded comment. Im sticking to my guns though, even a self sacrificing person can only help someone as well as he as able to maintain himself. It's development 101. Fantasy games even carry some realism in my campaigns.

As far as balance, paladins untill DP were considered one of the worst if not the worst class in the game. With the release of DP it brought them a little bit closer to average.