Help! - Campaign reboot without actual reboot

[Terraism]

They would not know if the story in Cormyr has come to an end, what happend to the baron trying to seize control etc. I think they would feel cheated, in a way. And instead of an all new planescape campaign I would get a "We must get back to Cormyr asap" story. And as they advance in level, it would not be that hard to get to get back, would it? (I'm do not know that much about Sigil, but it is not like Ravenloft, is it? I mean, planar traveling is kind of the point in that setting...)

Well, do they have any enemies/foes that they've encountered in the past and strongly disliked? If so, what about transplanting one or two of them to Sigil along with the PCs (though not directly with,) and making it clear that, if they want to settle their score/take revenge, they can really only do it from there? That gives them something of a reason to stick around, anyway - at least long enough to put down roots a little deeper than they have at that inn you mentioned.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

* The planes are the traditional way to go with this, but at 9th level I don't recommend it. Too early. You want to hold the planes in reserve in case you have the same problem at level 13. By level 15, you should absolutely move the party to the planes, but we're not there yet.


* You're having this problem after 3 levels of gaming. I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I do want to point this out to you. Why? Because I'm going to be judgmental and guess that one of your standard plots is good for 2 or 3 levels of play. That doesn't help you with the current situation, but it's good for you to remember for future planning. And right now I'm going to assume that you're going to end up closing the next arc around level 12.

* I'm looking at Cormyr and I see ... the Lake of Dragons/Dragonmere. I also see pirate islands nearby. Dude! Pirates! And Kua-Toa are water guys! A perfect tie in! Drow -> Pirates -> Kua-Toa. You haven't said what the Drow are doing specifically, but it wouldn't be the first time the Drow have used humans against humans. The pirates could not only function as a liason between the Drow and the Kua-Toa, but they could be using Drow weapons on their ships to terrorize the waves.

Maybe introduce some kind of Drow metal dust or powder that explodes when exposed to sunlight. That would lead to weird looking cannon and pistols for the pirates. The PCs have to stop the flow of this dust to the pirates or there won't be a Cormyr left to save!

Or maybe the Drow were feinting. They faked one move and employed the pirates to do the "real" work. The PCs have stopped the drow, learned of the real plot, and now have to stop the pirates before they trade whatever it is back to the drow.

Or the pirates could be employed by the drow to get something the drow can't. Maybe something that is kept in pure sunlight at all times. However the pirates are also working for the Kua-Toa and plan to sell whatever it is to the highest bidder.

Pirates are cool.

 

[Obergnom]

Do your players want to do this, or do they want to continue wandering around? Have you found that out?

Well, they do what ever I present them. Which is one of my major problems with the campaign as is. It put my players pretty much in Adventure Path mode. They follow the story like well behaving little puppies... they do that because they do not want to ruin my plot! And thats the worst thing that can happen to me, as I am rather good at on the fly creation but rapidly bored by my own stories.

They started at 6th level? Do they have any backstory? Families, friends? You should be able to find something in their history to give them some knowledge about the city. Think of this like a movie sequel where the audience suddenly gets an influx of information they didn't have before in the original. "Oh, we never talked about where you grew up? Well, as it turns out...."

They have some backstory... but the managed to all do the I am from X and I am more or less a mercenary thing. Kind of sad but true.

You're having this problem after 3 levels of gaming. I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I do want to point this out to you. Why? Because I'm going to be judgmental and guess that one of your standard plots is good for 2 or 3 levels of play. That doesn't help you with the current situation, but it's good for you to remember for future planning. And right now I'm going to assume that you're going to end up closing the next arc around level 12.

Not entirely untrue . Actually I prefere playing to writing plots and 3 month (=3 levels of play in our group) is about the maximum of time I stay interessted in a plot/story/theme of my own device. Thats why I prefere to run sandbox campaigns. I can switch themes more easily without having to restart campaigns every 3 month. (My players hate when I do that, allthough it happens occasionally)

I'm looking at Cormyr and I see ... the Lake of Dragons/Dragonmere. I also see pirate islands nearby. Dude! Pirates!

You had me when you said pirates! I would love to play the Savage Tide AP, but I'm neither the DM for ultra long story nor the player to like linear games... I think you just revived my interest for my campaign. Or to be more precise, in having the campaign stay in Cormyr. If I can find a way of having the old plot and pirates folded into one, I will be a very happy DM indeed. I just need to be careful to avoid my previous mistake, I do not really want to create so much as a story, but a situation the players might solve however they see fit.

Btw. The players really pissed of a Mind Flayer (who fled via Plane Shift) by killing all his Troglodyte Experiments/Minions and is favorite Pet. The even made him suffer a "Sucking Chest Wound" (I love Paizos Crit Deck) ... know, maybe some of you know this miniature... awesome miniature I can't think of anyway how to make that even remotely plausible, but it would be just wounderful...


So, new call for help: How to fold Pirates into the Plot? How did a Mind Flayer the PCs banished from his underdark lair become a Pirate?




To make things easier, here is the story so far, copied from the other threat:

The characters were drawn into the story to end a threat to Cormyr. They were send to kill a Hill Giant leader, who was uniting the giant tribes into a mighty army, that could overrun the kingdom. They were able to slay him, but discovered he was actually possessed by a Vrock demon. At the same time, the kingdom is threatend by civil war, as many nobles refuse to follow the infant king any longer and try to use the giant invasion for their own goals. The invasion started, allthough the players were able to kill the leader of the Hill Giants. There must be someone else behind all this. A mighty divination (Locate Creature) told them, the Vrock teleported to Mirth Galnorn. (The Name is in Drow, meaning refuge of revenge.) As they severly offended Baron Teuselle, a local noble and bastard descendent of the old King of Cormyr who was about to take over the town of Tilverton (The groups "homebase" - the rested 8 times in an inn there) and all of eastern Cormyr, the small group of loyal followers of the crown (The local captain of the purple dragons, some old adventurers/now inn keeper, an elven Magic Item Shop owner, the local high priests of Gond and Sharress and the local sage) decided, it would be the best course of action, to send the Party of Adventurers into the underdark trying to find the Demon and maybe the true head behind the giant invasion, while they try to work on the political floor, weakening the baron in anyway they can. The party started their descent into the underdark (Following a map they got from a lokal priest of gond), so far they passed the Grotto of the Troglodytes, making more enemies, by letting their Mind Flayer "Leader" escape. After that, the players continued their descent and after a long time and some dangerous encounters, they finally arived at Earth' End, a place run by earth creatures, who go there to leave fearun behind, traveling through the local portal into the Elemental Plane of Earth. The players did some information gathering, they discovered the likely location of the drow outpost. THe learned, for non earth creatures, to activate the portal a substance called "pure hope" is needed. "Pure Hope" is a very valuable substance, usually a gift from creatures living on the plane of Elysium, but the Kuo-Toa of Bhal-Hamatung trade with it, too. No one knows how these creatures are able to harvest "Pure Hope"... The characters traveled into the direction of the drow outpost, and the next session will probably see a lot of fighting against the inhabitants of the Drow Outpost.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Talk to your players. You don't need to come up with an in-game reason for things, when they can do it for you.

 

[EditorBFG]

1) Something is hidden in the city that players will not to find, but make it clear they could be there for months or years trying to find it. Maybe an artifact buried somewhere, or a prophecy that says some kind of special person is in the city. If the city is bustling, they would know finding it would be a long process.

The McGuffin worked for Hitchcock, it can work for you too.

2) One of the characters inherits property in the city, perhaps even a small tower. Or they find the deed, or an NPC grants it to them as a reward, etc. Players are eager to get all the mileage they can out of that sort of thing.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

If I can find a way of having the old plot and pirates folded into one, I will be a very happy DM indeed. I just need to be careful to avoid my previous mistake, I do not really want to create so much as a story, but a situation the players might solve however they see fit.

If you are really and truly not going to use the Savage Tides Adventure Path, that whole thing is ripe for plunder matey, arr! You can use encounters and locations and switch out the monsters. There's a sea voyage in there, for example, and you can use elements of that if the PCs go sailing.

I can't think of anyway how to make that even remotely plausible, but it would be just wounderful...

A mind flayer is CR 8. Give him two levels of swashbuckler and that puts him technically at CR 10, though arguably CR 9 because they're non-associative levels. The bonus to BaB will help with touch attacks. Nice! Or you could make him a psi warrior and simply have him use a cutlass for flair. That works too.

So, new call for help: How to fold Pirates into the Plot? How did a Mind Flayer the PCs banished from his underdark lair become a Pirate?

He knows about Pure Hope, but can't really make use of it or he's simply not powerful enough to guard it. That was why he never made a try for the stuff when he was the "god" of the troglodytes. It'd be like a pick pocket going after the Mona Lisa, even if he could pull it off, there's no way he'd be able to hold on to it.

But after he was cast out, he found an exit that was sub-aquatic. He swum up and managed to make it to a small island where a pirate crew were berthed. He was captured and taunted for sport, until he reached out with his tentacles and slew the pirate captain. The pirates of the ship (known as the Dread Typhoon) knew they could take him down ... but not without losses and no one wants to be the first to die, eh?

At first he ruled by fear, then he manipulated with psi, now he commands with gold. The pirates of the Dread Typhoon are bound to no law, below the ground or above the waves. The know where to get the mystical Pure Hope. They know the Kua Toa want it. And nothing will stop them from plunder!

Their first move will be to get other pirate ships under their command. Nobody has noticed so far because the fighting has meant fewer pirate attacks on merchant ships. Who would complain about that? But now the mind flayer commands five ships and he's still expanding his army. While the other four ships conquer, he and the crew of the Dread Typhoon are on their own quest to secure a minor item of power for a group of aboleths who are willing to join in with their cause if given sufficient payment. (maybe something that will let them "swim" on land, so the aboleths can expand their realm above ground?)

The PCs first encounter the pirates when they attack. They then need to beat the Dread Typhoon to the relic OR decide if they want to take down the other three ships (maybe more by now). If they attack the Dread Typhoon first, they'll see that the mind flayer has had someone ... or some THING! .... construct a permanent one-way psionic teleport circle as an escape route, so you can keep using him as a bad guy.


So, they'll have to beat up pirates, then go underwater and beat up aboleths, and then beat up some more pirates. The pirates on the ships they encounter later on should be more exotic. The mind flayer isn't bound by human morals and has drawn quite the eclectic bunch to his crew.

How's that work for you?

 

[Obergnom]

If you are really and truly not going to use the Savage Tides Adventure Path, that whole thing is ripe for plunder matey, arr! You can use encounters and locations and switch out the monsters. There's a sea voyage in there, for example, and you can use elements of that if the PCs go sailing.

Well, I'm seriously considering getting into that path at this point. I just looked through some of the adventures, they are fantastic. But being the kind of DM I am, I would try to do a late entrance (ie. somehow starting the whole thing with the level 10 adventure, Tides of Dread, maybe doing a best of Sea Wyverns Wake/Here there be monsters to reach that level and destination and preparing for a possible drop out after every adventure after that one... but I do not know enough about that AP (I have played the first adventure as a player in a different group, and I know its themes) to make this work. I will have to do a lot of research IF I want to do that.

On the other hand, your idea about that Mind Flayer Captain is pure gold... I can see my players expressions when they see that "Pirate"... muhar!

Pure Hope really seems to be one of the best things to motivate further stories in my campaign. My players came up with all kinds of weird ideas how the Kuo-Toa got it. (My favorite: An "Angel Juice Extractor" ... my original plan, some "Nightmare Machine" made by the Aboleth controling the Kuo-Toa allowing to suck the hope out of hopeful creatures of all kinds. Which Kuo-Toa are not. They are rather apocalyptic)

EDIT: If I would use the STAP (or parts of it) I think I would try to start with "Tides of Dread" which is a 10th level Adventure. I do not know much about it, but it says it could be used as a late entry point into the AP. I could do a summary of the 2 that came before as a journey style adventure to reach the location. Oh, and I would need to put that Mind Flayer in there somewhere

 

[Nyeshet]

An interesting set up.

What if the Kuo-toa trade with the vrock for Pure Hope? Perhaps it can also help open an underground portal to the elemental plane of water? The idea that Pure Hope - normally a celestial gift, is being created / extracted through fiendish means that leave captured mortals incapable of hope, drowning in despair, has a certain perversion that might appeal to a fiend. Perhaps when the PCs come upon the Kuo-toa settlement they will find only a few traces of the substance - not enough to activate the earth plane portal (or even the water plane portal hidden in the settlement). They discover when questioning prisoners or looking through the rooms of the settlement's shaman / witchdoctor / cleric that the vrock is also the source for the Pure Hope - but not how it is made.

They set off to deal with the vrock, succeed in finding him - and perhaps even slaying him (or maybe he gets away, becoming a notable foe once they are higher in level), and they are left with the dellema of whether to use the Pure Hope, now that they know how it was made / extracted - and perhaps even what to do with the prisoners, presuming any still live.

Or perhaps while fighting the Kuo-toa they accidentally follow it through a portal, not realizing the presence of the portal until they notice the sudden shift in architecture around them - and the more numerous kuo-toa suddenly surrounding them. They are captured, but due to the fight the portal is damaged. They are placed in a prison for the time being, perhaps later to be traded to the vrock in exchange for some more Pure Hope. (After all, the vrock needs prisoners from somewhere to make the Pure Hope.) They work with other prisoners to escape, but in the process they are discovered and have to chance going through a portal to an unknown location. They find themselves free but in the sewers of a large city completely unknown to them (language included).

Not knowing how to activate the portal to return (even if they wanted to), and not wanting to wait around in case Kuo-toa start swarming out of the portal to capture them again, they (and any surviving prisoners) must work their way through the sewers and out into the unknown city. Perhaps it is even a port city, and you can work in the pirate adventure you want. Indeed, perhaps some NPCs they stumble upon in the city recognize their language as one used by travelers from another continent, and the PCs have to hire onto a ship to make their way back home the non-magical way.

 

[Obergnom]

Having done a bit more research and considering those great ideas above, I deviced a new Background for the Campaign. This plot will rn in the background though, I plan on using it as an event guideline and watch what my players will do. The finale if and whenever it would happen, would be the Adventure "The Harrowing" from Dungeon Mag #84. I played this before with a different group and had a blast.

Background: What happened so far and what will happen in the future is actually a plot by Eclavdra, the first Priestess of Lolth's Church, to raise in Rank. (the only way for her to da that, as she is allready the highest ranking priestess is becoming a goddess, if possible the goddess of the Drow.
She deviced a ritual that could make her a (demi)goddess. As a goddess she would be very much out of Lolth reach, as she became a divine player, and she figured, once she is a goddes, there will be ways to raise in rank further.
What she needed first, though, were followers. She started a new cult among the Drow. A cult of outcasts, drider and Drow from falen houses, but also of lesser houses, promising them a better standing in "the new order".
To be able to do this, without being destroyed by Lolth, she did not use her name for the Cult, but the name Laveth, the Dark Daughter. Thus would lead would be investigators on the wrong track, looking for scions of Lolth and not her highest priestess as the origin of the cult. The drawback of this is, that while she has a cult, its worship is not really directed at her, thus she recives no power through it. She was able to give her followers spell casting abilities, though, striking a deal with Vheraun. He figured that anything that weakens Lolth would further his goals.
To be able to perform the ritual of the Harrowing, Eclavdra needs the power of thousands of souls of good mortals. She build the soul receptacles, 4 or more powerfull artifacts that would consume the souls of recently the slain. All she needed was a full scale slaughter in a country of good on the material plane.
This is where the campaign started. The first plot of Eclavdra involved a small enclave of drow outcasts who she absorbed into her cult and used to whip the giants into war. These drow do not know why she wanted them to do that.
They failed, though. While there actually was an invasion of giants, this was by far not as lasting as would have been needed to fill all the soul receptacles. Disappointed she looked for more ways to sent the Kingom of Cormyr into chaos.
Her eyes fell upon the Crimson Fleet. A powerful fleet of Pirates trafficing with demons. She was easily able to get her followers into that fleet and to have them attack the coastal cities of Cormyr.

What the players might know:

There will be a hint at the drow outpost, pointing out someones disappointment about relative failure of the giant invasion. The letter is signed with the symbol of the Dark Daughter, though noone will be able to figure that out, unless the players use a speak with dead. (Which they might do, of course)

The players will learn that there were 3 huge battles before the invasion of the giants could be stoped. No one fallen in those battles could be resurected. Not a single soul could be contacted in the afterlife.

What the players might do:

I do not know. I guess there will be some researching the recent events, but I will soon start the attacks of the Crimson Fleet, which will be able to destroy large parts of Cormyrs fleet by a supprise attack.

I hope to get my players to Marsember before that, though. There will, I guess, allways be a good reason to do so. As I plan Tilverton to be more or less destroyed, maybe they just follow some of the NPCs they know to Marsember.

The Mind Flayer: He will be part of the Crimson fleet. How exactly he came to be there, the players might one day figure out. Or not. (I think I would follow BiggusGeekus idea)

Pure Hope... well, I somehow lost it in this plot. Stil, my players might try to get it, and it might come in handy at some time later on.