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D&D 5E help me play with prestige classses/paragon paths

I'd personally make Prestige Classes into Feats with prerequisites, probably in sets of two or three. So any PC that could qualify for a Purple Dragon Knight would be able to gain progressive benefits at 4th, 8th and 12th levels (or faster for some classes), should the player decide to advance further down the path of the Dragon Knight.

I've always loved the concept for PrCs for fluff reasons, but their implementation was too fiddly for my taste.
 

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My feeling is that prestige classes is a dead concept and better replaced by other options; in 5E that would be subclasses, in Pathfinder it would be archetypes. In some cases a single subclass might become more than one archetype. In fact, I've authored a work that does exactly this for Pathfinder: Core Prestige Archetypes Subscription

(Shameless plug, I know.)
 

You can of course give Bob membership in the Knights who say Ni and that nice magic crystall ball to the wizard, mixing and matching boons and items. That can be especially useful, if some players enjoy items more and some more are more into "internal" stuff. I really enjoyed the flexibility in 4e. But yes, it's extra.

We can do what we want, tho personally I wouldn't still use boons vs magic items, because then I might end up having two problems if I have to try to force some balance of boons vs items, especially when it's the same players who enjoy both.

Note that in the PHB, Shadowdancers are explicitly mentioned as Monks with the Way of Shadows sub-class.

It's ok, but that shows what we have lost in the process: in 3e the Shadowdancers could be a diverse groups of characters with different base classes, in 5e they all have to be Monks. The new mechanics have forced the narrative to change. Being tied to one class only is exactly the limit of using subclasses (although we can think about designing some subclasses so that they work fine on multiple base classes).

I've always loved the concept for PrCs for fluff reasons, but their implementation was too fiddly for my taste.

But that's pretty much what I loved about prestige classes in 3e: the character concepts that they often offered (excluding typically those PrCls designed to "fix" weak multiclassing combos).

The other thing I loved, is that they also introduced several cool functional/mechanical features, but sadly this was only sometimes. Many other times, they offered only a re-hash of existing features, or (even worse) generic "bonus feats".

I agree that implementation sucked, more often than not. And that was occasionally because of poor design, but IMHO the true reason for implementation suckage was that the 3e framework around almost required them to suck... With that I mean the following two issues:

- 3e prestige classes needed prerequisites that forced a minimum entry level, and some general overall "cost"; this largely dominated over narrative requirements, and turned them into a mini-game of "character build"; the original designers (i.e. Monte Cook) intended prestige classes open to as many base classes as possible, hence his original suggestions to avoid explicitly requiring a minimum level in a class, and use implicit requirements instead (such as BAB or skill ranks); however, most of the prestige classes afterwards were still designed specifically with one (or two) base classes in mind, so we got these pathetic wanna-be-implicit-but-really-explicit requirements

- because all characters needed to keep progressing in BAB, skill points, hit points, saving throws, and spellcasting, each prestige class needed to specify all these (plus proficiencies); this made their design a bit more burdensome, but most importantly it made a prestige class work much better with some base class and much worse with others, thus diminishing the original intended openness even further

I say that in 5e we are mostly free from these 2 problems. There is still a need to define hit points, but it isn't a major problem. And we can totally drop mechanical prerequisites... those made sense in 3e also because the edition valued "system mastery", but as a secondary effect they also entitled players ("What do you mean I can't be a Knight of XYZ? It took me 6 levels to gather all requirements!"). If we moved entirely towards narrative requirements, maybe the players attitude towards prestige classes will also improve.
 

It's ok, but that shows what we have lost in the process: in 3e the Shadowdancers could be a diverse groups of characters with different base classes, in 5e they all have to be Monks.

I am not sure that is mechanically true. In 3.5, because the prestige class itself was a class, you had to multiclass to take it. In 5th, all that has changed is the multiclass is a base class.

So if you were a Rogue 4, Shadowdancer 4, you become a Rogue 4, Monk (Way of Shadow) 4. It's not a huge change.

The only people who can't easily convert are people who had multiple prestige classes that are now Sub-Classes, but frankly they should be pretty rare anyway.
 

First we must answer the question: Why have any classes? Point-buy systems are popular; so why have classes? Or, what makes a good core class?

A good class represents a strong archetype: characters with many common traits AND a good story hook. We've all read fantasy novels in which a hardened warrior shows up and thought, "yup, that's a fighter." You know what that guy's going to do in the story because he conforms to an archetype.

Now the strongest archetypes get to be core classes. Where does this leave prestige classes? Well, the are not available at level 1, the way subclasses and backgrounds are. Levels represent experience, time, and change, so a prestige class must represent an archetype that characters become, rather than something they start out as. In the original Star Wars trilogy, "Jedi" was such an archetype, because Luke was working to become one. (Obi-Wan and Vader are already "high level" characters.)

There are a vanishingly small number of archetypes that fit this pattern. "Dragon King" from Dark Sun is probably one. Knight of the Rose, probably. Maybe Hathran. But most other setting-specific archetypes are available from level 1. So they'd make better subclasses, feats, or backgrounds, depending on how diverse the archetype is.
 

So if you were a Rogue 4, Shadowdancer 4, you become a Rogue 4, Monk (Way of Shadow) 4. It's not a huge change.

Uhm, yes it is...

Now the strongest archetypes get to be core classes. Where does this leave prestige classes?

If you see prestige classes only as archetypes, you're limiting yourself, and by the same reasoning we could just ditch subclasses and feast too. Try to see all these as design tools to deliver character features. That's what prestige classes may still be useful for in 5e, considering the limitations of subclasses and feats. Three delivery mechanics instead of two, give you more design options, because each of them has strengths and weaknesses.
 

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