Help me understand my computers, and what to update!

[Nellisir]

I've got two "primary" computers and one significantly older one.

I'm trying to understand what my best courses of action are for updating and upgrading the computers.

No computer games on any of them.

My primary computer is a 1-year old HP Pavilion dv9700 laptop which I use for school. Common programs are AutoCAD, Photoshop, Sketchup, & illustrator (plus Word & Firefox & etc). I don't have graphic card info to hand right now; it would be whatever was installed at the factory. It works well but occasionally chokes on large files in Illustrator & sketchup.
Intel Core 2Duo CPU T5750 @2.00 GHz
4 GB RAM
64 Bit
Windows Vista
300 GB hard drive (mostly full; need to transfer stuff out)

I'm guessing more memory, and upgrading to Win 7. Beyond that, I don't know. Graphics programs are absolutely essential to what I'm doing, though, so the more I can do in that regard the better.

The desktop is a Black Friday special from 2 (?) years ago.
Compaq Presario.
AMD Athlon 64 processor
3700+
1.79 Ghz
960 MB RAM
WinXP + updates.
hard drive around 250 GB

More memory, clearly. I'm not sure how much it can take. Ideally I'd set this up so I can work on either it or the laptop, but not sure what this can handle. Looks like Win 7 wants a minimum of 1 GB memory, so that would need an upgrade (not that it wouldn't otherwise).

There's also a 6-year old Toshiba laptop that needs to be reformatted, but otherwise has run flawlessly for 6 years. Wondering if it can be made into a netbook or something at some point. Runs Win XP with updates.

Thanks!

Crossposted from Circvs Maximvs

 

[XCorvis]

Your primary is a perfectly fine computer. It comes with a GeForce 8600 series graphics card with 256 MB of RAM. Since it's a laptop, upgrading your RAM may not really be an option. I think that motherboard maxes out at 4 GB. Pretty much the only thing you might be able to upgrade is the hard drive, but I don't really think that would be helpful. An update to Win7 is very much worth it, it may help performance too. Just make sure your apps work with it first.

A minimal upgrade on the desktop would be to install Win7 and up the RAM to 2 GB. If you want to run graphics apps, drop ~$100 on a new graphics card and up the RAM to 4 GB. It should take at least that much, but it might be able to go more. I wouldn't bother with more than 4 GB since the processor is only single core. That's a larger limiting factor for performance.

For your old Toshiba, just wipe it and reinstall Windows XP. Load it with only lightweight, fast apps. Maybe visit some of the "make XP run faster" type websites and strip out extra junk from the OS. Voila! Instant (clunky) netbook.

 

[Merkuri]

A minimal upgrade on the desktop would be to install Win7 and up the RAM to 2 GB. If you want to run graphics apps, drop ~$100 on a new graphics card and up the RAM to 4 GB. It should take at least that much, but it might be able to go more. I wouldn't bother with more than 4 GB since the processor is only single core. That's a larger limiting factor for performance.

Even with Windows 7, the limit for RAM on a 32-bit system is 4 GB. Any more than that simply won't be used.

However, a 64-bit version of Windows 7 can use 8-16 GB of RAM, depending on whether you get Home Basic or Home Premium.

Memory Limits for Windows Releases (Windows)

And you can upgrade memory in laptops, but it can sometimes be hard to get to. I upgraded the memory in my Acer TravelMate a few years ago. One stick was simple to get to (just flip the computer over and unscrew a panel), but for the other I had to remove the entire keyboard. It was not actually that difficult for me, but I've been playing around in the inside of desktop computers since I was fifteen.

If you've never swapped components inside a desktop computer, or even if you have but you don't feel comfortable playing with the inside of a relatively tiny, delicate laptop, take it to a professional and ask them to do it for you. If you want to try it yourself, make sure you read the manual carefully and take every precaution. Frying a laptop motherboard with static electricity is an expensive lesson.

Oh, and remember that laptop memory is different than desktop memory. Don't buy a "normal" stick of RAM and expect to stick it in a laptop.

 

[Nellisir]

Your primary is a perfectly fine computer. It comes with a GeForce 8600 series graphics card with 256 MB of RAM. Since it's a laptop, upgrading your RAM may not really be an option. I think that motherboard maxes out at 4 GB. Pretty much the only thing you might be able to upgrade is the hard drive, but I don't really think that would be helpful. An update to Win7 is very much worth it, it may help performance too. Just make sure your apps work with it first.

Thanks! I did some more research last night, and insofar as I can tell, 4GB of RAM is max, so that's not an option. I had was making Illustrator do things it shouldn't really be doing, so I'm working on improving my workflow & learning programs to use when appropriate so file size doesn't get so unwieldy - which takes care of the Illustrator problem.
I was planning on updating to Win 7 over winter break - no way was I going to screw with my computer just before all my projects were due!

A minimal upgrade on the desktop would be to install Win7 and up the RAM to 2 GB. If you want to run graphics apps, drop ~$100 on a new graphics card and up the RAM to 4 GB. It should take at least that much, but it might be able to go more. I wouldn't bother with more than 4 GB since the processor is only single core. That's a larger limiting factor for performance.

OK; that's what I was leaning towards.
Now, from what I've just read, 32-bit vs 64-bit is not a hardware spec, or not hardware reliant? In other words, I could potentially install 64-bit Win 7 on the desktop? (I probably won't, since that would be a total install & require a full version of Win 7, which costs more $$$ than an upgrade - and I realize going from Win XP to Win 7 is a bigger jump than Vista to Win 7, but that's OK - everything on the desktop can be backed up to my external harddrive, and there's nothing on there that isn't duplicated on one of the laptops.)

For your old Toshiba, just wipe it and reinstall Windows XP. Load it with only lightweight, fast apps. Maybe visit some of the "make XP run faster" type websites and strip out extra junk from the OS. Voila! Instant (clunky) netbook.

Thanks! I researched this last night and came to the same conclusion. Like I said, it's been running like a trooper since I bought it. I got a new battery and upgraded RAM three or four years ago, otherwise never a problem. The HP had far more issues, initially.

 

[Nellisir]

Even with Windows 7, the limit for RAM on a 32-bit system is 4 GB. Any more than that simply won't be used.

However, a 64-bit version of Windows 7 can use 8-16 GB of RAM, depending on whether you get Home Basic or Home Premium.

Home Premium, without a doubt. I commonly have several programs running at once when I'm working (Photoshop & Illustrator & Bridge & Firefox & Powerpoint & Media Player two nights ago, for instance, when I was pulling together a presentation)

If you've never swapped components inside a desktop computer, or even if you have but you don't feel comfortable playing with the inside of a relatively tiny, delicate laptop, take it to a professional and ask them to do it for you. If you want to try it yourself, make sure you read the manual carefully and take every precaution. Frying a laptop motherboard with static electricity is an expensive lesson.

I upgraded RAM on an older desktop, so I'm a bit more comfortable there. When I upgraded the RAM on my older laptop, I took it in.

Oh, and remember that laptop memory is different than desktop memory. Don't buy a "normal" stick of RAM and expect to stick it in a laptop.

That much I do remember.

How do I determine how much RAM my desktop can handle, and the type of memory it needs?

 

[Merkuri]

Now, from what I've just read, 32-bit vs 64-bit is not a hardware spec, or not hardware reliant? In other words, I could potentially install 64-bit Win 7 on the desktop?

You can only install a 64-bit operating system on a 64-bit processor. A 32-bit processor can't handle a 64-bit operating system. However, most of the time you could install a 32-bit operating system on a 32-bit processor, but that really depends on the processor itself. Most modern 64-bit processors can operate in 32-bit mode if necessary.

...I realize going from Win XP to Win 7 is a bigger jump than Vista to Win 7...

Windows 7 and Vista are so similar that upgrading from XP to Win 7 will probably be no different than upgrading from XP to Vista. Windows 7 is basically what Vista was supposed to be.

I work at a software company, and it took us no effort at all to get our products certified as compatible with Windows 7 because they were already compatible with Vista. The jump from XP to Vista was leagues larger than the jump from Vista to Windows 7.

Of course, having said that, Windows 7 is much much better than Vista. If you have a choice between the two then definitely go with Win7. Vista is going to be one of those "best forgotten, you're lucky if you missed it" operating systems, like Windows ME.

How do I determine how much RAM my desktop can handle, and the type of memory it needs?

The motherboard determines how much RAM your hardware can handle, but remember that it's possible your operating system may only be able to use so much of it. If you search for your computer model number or motherboard model number online you can usually find out what kind of memory it takes.

There are a lot of websites that sell memory that allow you to input in the make and model of your computer and it'll tell you how much memory it can handle and will show you a list of memory they offer that's compatible. Last time I bought memory I went to one of these sites, typed in my computer info, wrote down the specs of the memory it thought I needed, then I went to search for the best price for that memory. I think I actually went to a couple different memory-selling sites just to make sure they agreed on the type of memory I needed.

Edit: Oh, and just a thought about upgrading the video card for a desktop, make sure your motherboard can handle the type of card you buy. My fiance and I had desktop machines that were ~5 years old and we realized that neither one of us could upgrade our video cards to play the types of games that were coming out now because our motherboards didn't have PCIe slots. Most modern video cards require a PCIe slot. And if you want to upgrade your motherboard then you might as well get a whole new PC and cannibalize the old one for parts.

 

[drothgery]

You can only install a 64-bit operating system on a 64-bit processor. A 32-bit processor can't handle a 64-bit operating system. However, most of the time you could install a 32-bit operating system on a 32-bit processor, but that really depends on the processor itself. Most modern 64-bit processors can operate in 32-bit mode if necessary.

... and almost all non-netbook CPUs sold since 2006 are 64-bit capable (including both of the original poster's).

 

[Cergorach]

The slowest part of that laptop is it's hard drive, might want to look into an SSD (and possibly an external drive for storage). Intel X25-M (G2) in 80GB or 160GB look promising.

That PC really needs to be replaced! It's a sorry matter when your laptop outperforms your PC ;-) An I7 920 with 12GB or an I7 860 with 8GB would be a very nice replacement.

 

[Thanee]

An I7 920 with 12GB or an I7 860 with 8GB would be a very nice replacement.

While they are certainly nice, I can hardly see a justification for such an expensive CPU ($300+? and that's just the CPU) for what Nellisir is doing. Unless he is doing some serious 3D rendering, a more economic choice should be pursued and totally sufficient for years to come.


Upgrading to Win7 from Vista is certainly doable, just be sure, that you have all the specific drivers for your laptop hardware at hand (hp homepage should have those; hp is pretty good with driver support).

Bye
Thanee

 

[Nellisir]

The slowest part of that laptop is it's hard drive, might want to look into an SSD (and possibly an external drive for storage). Intel X25-M (G2) in 80GB or 160GB look promising.

That PC really needs to be replaced! It's a sorry matter when your laptop outperforms your PC ;-) An I7 920 with 12GB or an I7 860 with 8GB would be a very nice replacement.

Next computer in line is a new laptop for my wife, since she's the one stuck using the Toshiba right now. (she could use the Presario, but apparently being able to sit on the sofa & watch tv is an important part of Facebook & bill paying. I dunno. All I know is the bills are paid and I get to hear about the lives of complete strangers that apparently went to high school with her in Bangkok.)

I feel like the desktop is really old, but frankly, it's not. I think a big part of it is that it has a pretty crummy & small monitor, and studying landscape architecture, which is pretty graphics intensive, I'm surrounded by pretty high end machinery at school. I'd like to get a new monitor, but the lady with the money points out that I'm not really using it right now...I think there's a catch-22 involved in that, but since I can't promise I'll use it more with a new monitor, I'm not sure.

What would be nice would be working out a way to use the Toshiba as an extension of the desktop, so she could sit on the sofa & still use the bigger machine.