D&D 5E Hexblade (Warlock/Paladin)

[Heir Raktus]

I've seen the idea bantered about, but I am a poor optimizer myself. Was wondering if anyone else had ideas on this? From what I've read thus far, the base is a 3rd level warlock of the Blade Pact combined with an X level Paladin to cover defenses.

 

[Mandragola]

There definitely isn't a set way to do this. I don't know if it makes more sense to stick with paladin at higher levels or instead get more warlock. Either class gives you a second attack at 5th and a damage bonus at 11th or 12th - though realistically that's a long way down the line.

If you want to be dex-based you should start as a paladin, as that way you can avoid the strength requirement of becoming a MC paladin. A dex-based paladin is actually fine for the first couple of levels. You probably want to pick up level 2 for your fighting style and 3 for the oath. You'll also want to play a race that can start with two 16s, and a human might be a good plan so you can have a feat at first level. War caster will help you concentrate on keeping hex running.

I'm not sure a paladin benefits all that much from having 3 levels of warlock, but a warlock gains a fair bit from paladin levels, with a fighting style and access to lots of new spells - notably healing with warlock slots. Actually I'm not all that convinced it makes a better bladelock than just being a single-class warlock though. There are some other options that look good as well, such as being a fighter weapon master or a rogue assassin. Starting as fighter gives you con saves, which is really handy to maintain concentration. It does take quite a few levels for the benefits of multiclassing to really kick in though and there is a price to pay, with slower spell progression in particular.

I do think that a fey pact warlock multiclassed to an oath of ancients paladin would be a cool character. It would certainly work in game too. It would make for a pretty interesting guy, and potentially quite weird! Hex is actually such a great spell that parties would generally want someone who could cast it, for those times you meet a dragon or something. Mechanically the devotion or vengeance paladin builds might both arguably be better than ancients, since you get to use your channel to either add cha bonus to hit or get advantage for attacks.

A suggested start point might be something like the following:

Variant Human (if allowed). S8 D16 C14 I10 W8 C16 and War Caster. Maybe stealth as your bonus skill, though your perception won't be any good so you won't be much use as a scout. Start as a paladin and then multiclass to warlock at some point. Get 3 levels of paladin then carry on as a warlock. Your choice whether to go to lvl 3 and switch or mix in your first warlock level at level 2 or 3. I don't see tons of benefit in more paladin levels beyond 3, though obviously the stat boost at 4 is nice. You could actually go paladin 1 warlock 5 to get good spells fast-ish and the extra attack, and then get your paladin oath.

There is the option of going strength-based, though this makes things tricky until you get heavy armour proficiency. That could look like S16, D8, C14, I10, W8, C16. Basically hide and stay alive chucking eldritch blasts until level 2, then take a paladin level and put some armour on. You can then go around quite happily bashing stuff with a great weapon, which would probably work quite well.

 

[Heir Raktus]

I like your recomendations, but some things don't work in your examples. War Caster requires you to be able to cast at least one spell, A first level Paladin cannot. In the second build you recomended taking Paladin later and putting on heavy armor. MC'ing into Paladin doesn't give you heavy armor prof, that's why you would take Paladin first.

 

[Mandragola]

Ahh yes, well there are other feats you could take. Heavy Armour Master is amazing. Or you could go for another race like half elf or a non-variant human to have a better spread of stats.

 

[Runny]

My plan: human variant take heavy armor master at first level and athlete at fourth. Start Paladin, go Warlock for four levels, pick up Thirsting Blade (Devil's Sight for 2nd invocation), go Paladin for three levels, go Warlock for at-will Jump at level 9, go two levels of Paladin for Cha boost to saves, finish Warlock. I am modeling him off of the Shardbearers in the Stormlight novels (Way of Kings and Words of Radiance). I want too keep the casting based on improvements the could be attributable to the Shardblade or Shardplate. Spells like Spiderclimb are cool too because they replicate the surge binding. The go to spells are Hex and Armor of Agathys for Warlock and Cure Wounds for Paladin. Fire Shield is also a great spell for the whole magical armor vibe.

 

[Heir Raktus]

I've heard compelling arguements for Resilient (Constitution). I'd be interested to know if you had planned on a Strength build or a Dexterity build. Two-hander or Sword and board.

 

[PeteZero]

With S8 D16 C14 I10 W8 C16 you cannot multiclass a paladin. You need a 13 in strength (if I remeber it correct that you need STR13 and CHA13 for paladin multiclass)!
If I play I will combine War caster, polearm master and sentinel. Not sure if paladin is the right way or fighter, as the later gives you proficiency in con saves.

 

[Mandragola]

You do have to watch out for those tricky multiclassing rules. Oddly you can happily start out as a paladin with 8 dex, you just can't MC into one. No paladin abilities are directly linked to strength either, so a dex-based one really is fine - and potentially quite cool in fact. I could definitely see something like a wood elf oath of the ancients paladin existing, and being pretty awesome.

Other things to watch for are the prerequesites for warlock abilities. The ones that let you attack twice and add your charisma modifier to damage aren't available straight away. Indeed, most classes have something very similar available at 5th and 11th level, so by multiclassing you're sometimes putting off the time when you get your extra attack or damage bonus. It's a real trade off.

 

[Runny]

Not sure if you need both Proficiency in Con and Warcaster. Seems like just Warcaster would do the trick. Maybe I am being overly optimistic.

For pole arms, you'll need Strength, not Dex. I went 16 str, 8 Dex. Start Paladin and you have heavy armor. Fireballs are not going to be fun.

 

[Runny]

Ninja'd. Warlock is the only class that doesn't penalize Melee characters for multiclassing. The level 5 invocation is available based on character level, so fighter 1, warlock 4 gets Thirsty Blade.

 

[PeteZero]

But you can, who cares about DEX as a paladin? You can multiclass in and out of a paladin DEX8, but with STR8, you are stuck, no multiclassing at all.
So as a multiclass paladin/warlock you need STR13 and CHA13, no way around it, as you need to meet the prerequisites of your current and new class. And yes, you delay some abilities by a level, but getting heavy armor proficiency, and at lvl2 smite might be worth it.

You do have to watch out for those tricky multiclassing rules. Oddly you can happily start out as a paladin with 8 dex, you just can't MC into one. No paladin abilities are directly linked to strength either, so a dex-based one really is fine - and potentially quite cool in fact. I could definitely see something like a wood elf oath of the ancients paladin existing, and being pretty awesome.

Other things to watch for are the prerequesites for warlock abilities. The ones that let you attack twice and add your charisma modifier to damage aren't available straight away. Indeed, most classes have something very similar available at 5th and 11th level, so by multiclassing you're sometimes putting off the time when you get your extra attack or damage bonus. It's a real trade off.

 

[Dausuul]

You do have to watch out for those tricky multiclassing rules. Oddly you can happily start out as a paladin with 8 dex, you just can't MC into one.

You also can't MC out of one. You must meet the multiclassing requirements of all your classes, including the ones you already have. This is a change from how multiclassing worked in the playtest.

Ninja'd. Warlock is the only class that doesn't penalize Melee characters for multiclassing. The level 5 invocation is available based on character level, so fighter 1, warlock 4 gets Thirsting Blade.

This also is not correct. Even though you meet the level requirement, there is no way to get Thirsting Blade at fighter 1/warlock 4, because you don't get a new invocation at warlock 4! Your invocations come at warlock 2, 5, 7, 9, 12, 15, and 18. And you can't take Thirsting Blade at warlock 2, because it requires the Pact of the Blade, and you don't get your pact boon until warlock 3. There is simply no way to get Thirsting Blade earlier than warlock 5.

To the OP: If you want to go paladin/bladelock, Strength should be your top stat, then Charisma, then Constitution. Put your first level in paladin (for heavy armor), then your next five in warlock. After that, you can either stick with warlock for the rest of the game, or throw in more paladin levels to taste. If you choose the latter, it's best to arrange things so that when you hit level 12, you are either paladin 5/warlock 7, or paladin 3/warlock 9. That way you can pick up Lifedrinker on schedule.

Dexterity is a paladin-bladelock's natural dump stat. You have to have 13s in Charisma and Strength for multiclassing, and you need a solid Constitution if you're going to be a front-line fighter; unless you rolled stats and did amazingly well, it's going to be tough to pump Dexterity too. If you want to go the Dexterity route, fighter/bladelock or ranger/bladelock would work much better.

 

[Fion]

PHB 107

Eldritch Invocations
Additionally, when you gain a level in this class you can chose one of the invocations you know and replace it with another invocation that you could learn at this level.


Therefor getting Thirsting Blade is possible at Pally 1/Warlock 4 so long as that last level is Warlock. It's not ideal as you'll be losing the benefit of an Invocation but you can grab it again with Warlock 5 so no biggy.

 

[Mandragola]

Are we sure that when they say "level 5" they don't mean warlock level 5 though?

 

[Runny]

Fion replied for me.

 

[Runny]

That is the consensus

 

[Dausuul]

PHB 107

Eldritch Invocations
Additionally, when you gain a level in this class you can chose one of the invocations you know and replace it with another invocation that you could learn at this level.


Therefor getting Thirsting Blade is possible at Pally 1/Warlock 4 so long as that last level is Warlock. It's not ideal as you'll be losing the benefit of an Invocation but you can grab it again with Warlock 5 so no biggy.

Ah, you are correct - my mistake. That'll teach me to "correct" people without my PHB handy.

 

[Fion]

Ah, you are correct - my mistake. That'll teach me to "correct" people without my PHB handy.

What, you don't carry your PHB around everywhere you go? Guess that's just me.

 

[Runny]

Mine's in my briefcase.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Are we sure that when they say "level 5" they don't mean warlock level 5 though?

Mearls said on twitter that it's up to the DM. Which I think is ridiculous but whatever.